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VonNoble

Your legacy...

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1 hour ago, Jonathan H. B. Lobl said:

 

You do know what running amuck means, don't you?  It's a way of committing suicide.

 

Fifteen minutes of fame?  Be careful what you ask for.  I can imagine the headlines.  "Crazy old man running with dagger.  Falls down and hurts himself."

 

 

That would be crazy old naked man. That is where the fifteen minutes of fame come in. The rest can just be an obituary. 20 years from now i would be so old as to make suicide painless just like the tune.

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1 hour ago, Brother Kaman said:

That would be crazy old naked man. That is where the fifteen minutes of fame come in. The rest can just be an obituary. 20 years from now i would be so old as to make suicide painless just like the tune.

 

 

You might surprise yourself.  We don't have an actual expiration date.  

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On ‎11‎/‎7‎/‎2017 at 6:48 AM, VonNoble said:

The only thing about you that will live on forever is the kindness you have given.

 

Is that true?

 

von 

From my perspective... Everything about that which is YOU has always existed (in one form or another) and always will. All acts, good or bad, are recorded in the Akashic Record and any act of love lives forever as a part of the harmonious vibrations that construct the etheric plane......

Edited by Songster

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We can't know what will live on after us and for how long. We have our deeds now. How we conduct ourselves in the present is much more important than a future we will not participate in. If we do what is right the legacy will take care of itself.

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6 hours ago, Songster said:

From my perspective... Everything about that which is YOU has always existed (in one form or another) and always will. All acts, good or bad, are recorded in the Akashic Record and any act of love lives forever as a part of the harmonious vibrations that construct the etheric plane......

Interesting.    I’m gonna mull that over a bit.   Thank you.        von

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34 minutes ago, Stormbringer said:

We can't know what will live on after us and for how long. We have our deeds now. How we conduct ourselves in the present is much more important than a future we will not participate in. If we do what is right the legacy will take care of itself.

Then you agree our actions now carry forward after us?     What we do now then therefore matters in the future?

 

von

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21 hours ago, VonNoble said:

In that case there is no longer a need for the word legacy ;)

 

Or the word humankind.

 

Rather fitting to go out the way we came in; with a Big Bang?

If I go out the way I came in, I will be naked and covered in my mother's blood. Not a good look. 

 

Anyway, our ability to accurately predict the future is not exactly perfect. Our lives are filled with unintended consequences and other surprises. But we need to be confident in our ability to shape the future, in order to be motivated actors. It makes life interesting. We all more or less have an idea of what our legacy will be made up of, and we are all more or less wrong about it. Fun stuff.

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7 minutes ago, mererdog said:

 But we need to be confident in our ability to shape the future, in order to be motivated actors. It makes life interesting. We all more or less have an idea of what our legacy will be made up of, and we are all more or less wrong about it. Fun stuff.

 I agree.   Fun stuff indeed.   I’ll work the morning long to get your exit image out of my mind.    Thanks for the chuckle.   Presumably your family opted not to have a photographer at the birthing?  

 

von

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Just now, VonNoble said:

 I agree.   Fun stuff indeed.   I’ll work the morning long to get your exit image out of my mind.    Thanks for the chuckle.   Presumably your family opted not to have a photographer at the birthing?  

 

von

My mother did not take care of us while she was pregnant, and I had a difficult birth. That brings up an interesting thought about legacies. The only thing my wife knows about her mother is that she was a prostitute who used heroin and cocaine during her pregnancy. It is completely possible the woman turned her life around and built herself a nice positive legacy. But, to my wife, she will always be a crack-whore.

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Even for only having been seen, changes things than the way things might otherwise have been. Changes a view, a thought, an emotion, etc.

Even only for that, a mark is left, however intangible. If that isn't a legacy in itself, then maybe legacies don't really exist.

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On 11/10/2017 at 4:57 AM, mererdog said:

My mother did not take care of us while she was pregnant, and I had a difficult birth. That brings up an interesting thought about legacies. The only thing my wife knows about her mother is that she was a prostitute who used heroin and cocaine during her pregnancy. It is completely possible the woman turned her life around and built herself a nice positive legacy. But, to my wife, she will always be a crack-whore.

 

And yet - there are two additional pieces to the puzzle (btw, I admire that your wife survived all that - that is a ton of stuff for a kid to overcome) 

 

a.  The crackhead , prostitute mother - did in fact give life (carried the wife to term) (which beats the alternative) 

b.  the negative (atypical) conditions surely made your wife stronger by virtue of that which did not kill her (she is resilient that wife of yours) 

 

Not all challenges are 100% negative.   It is that much more to your wife's credit that she did not become her mother sort of  - maybe. 

 

So the legacy was awful in some ways - but your wife surely became some of what she is because of that legacy - rising against the wind inspire of the odds is a sort of legacy, no?

von

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3 hours ago, VonNoble said:

La.  The crackhead , prostitute mother - did in fact give life (carried the wife to term) (which beats the alternative) 

That reminds me. You haven't thanked me for not shooting you. Kind of rude of you. I mean, here I am, selflessly not murdering you, and not so much as a card in the mail. Granted, I can't afford a gun and I keep forgetting to make an appointment to see you, but the thought doesn't count.

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4 hours ago, VonNoble said:

So the legacy was awful in some ways - but your wife surely became 

Be very careful with this sort of reasoning. You don't want to accidentally be the guy implying that victims should thank their rapists for the opportunity to learn to overcome their victimhood. You would probably get kicked... More than once... You know where...

Edited by mererdog

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1 hour ago, mererdog said:

That reminds me. You haven't thanked me for not shooting you. Kind of rude of you. I mean, here I am, selflessly not murdering you, and not so much as a card in the mail. Granted, I can't afford a gun and I keep forgetting to make an appointment to see you, but the thought doesn't count.

You have a point...but abortions have always been a form of birth control.    The mother might have (we din’t know)...she might have thought in her fuzzball mind that somehow she would be a better person (she failed) but that doesn’t mean she fully saw she was making life horrible for the child.    Obviously she did not operate with reason.    So assuming it was only selfish motives makes mom pretty one dimensional... there were likely opportunities if not urging to kill the baby.    It is likely at some moments the child represented hope.... maybe ?   Maybe the daughter gave a way forward to the mother?    von 

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1 hour ago, mererdog said:

Be very careful with this sort of reasoning. You don't want to accidentally be the guy implying that victims should thank their rapists for the opportunity to learn to overcome their victimhood. You would probably get kicked... More than once... You know where...

1 hour ago, mererdog said:

You are correct.   I do not want to accidentally be that guy so I thank you for providing me with an angle that did not occur to me.

 

conversely all of life lessons are not on sanitized situations.    Frequently they are painful and traumatic.     Drunks lose families homes and jobs.    Survivors of any horrid circumstance sometimes pull out courage Long lain dormant.   We don’t thank the hurricanes or the enemy shooting at us... maiming us or raping us....but there is no denying the crucible forges us.  

 

Most often we would prefer to make it to adulthood and choose our own poison.   But we have to play the cards dealt.  Horrible and unfair tho that is... no person has a life free of trauma.  

 

 I feel horrible for your wife and every other child abused.    At the samd time by virtue of that fact... I certainly credit them with whatever IN THEM allowed them to rise in spite of it.    

 

The circumstances ( human or natural) are the catalyst.   Saying that does not note hurricanes or stupidity or cruelty as a good thing.... but an inevitable part of the human experience.... which is not logical or fair.

 

What we become because of it...  or do because of it.....can be a legacy ( Mother’s against drunk drivers...Amber alert)..... 

von

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19 hours ago, VonNoble said:

The mother might have (we din’t know)...

Yes. We don't know. We do know, however, that she harmed my wife and provided my wife with no justification for doing so. This causes continual emotional pain for my wife. At best, my wife is able to see her mother as a tragic victim doing her best amid horrible circumstances. At worst, she sees her mother as a heartless villain.

Edited by mererdog

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19 hours ago, VonNoble said:

What we become because of it...  or do because of it.....can be a legacy ( Mother’s against drunk drivers...Amber alert)..... 

Your legacy is what you give to the world, not what the world does with what you give them. If I give the world crap, I will have a crap legacy. If you take the crap I give you and make something beautiful to give the world, you can have a beautiful legacy. If I take that beauty and crap on it, destroying your legacy becomes part of my legacy. 

Edited by mererdog

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2 hours ago, mererdog said:

If I take that beauty and crap on it, destroying your legacy becomes part of my legacy. 

Hmmm.   Whatever the trauma.   It does not define us necessarily.    It impacts us....it definitely pains us and we are changed often because of it.   We do not forget.    Again I admire your wife for being able to see any humanity with her mother in such a horrible circumstance. It is to her credit.

 

One of my sisters was violently raped and left for dead.   She spent weeks in the hospital.   Years repairing her dental work. And more than a decade keeping this as a secret.    She lived in another state and did not see the family till most of her face was normal enough again. I was the only one in the family who knew.

 

It took time....rehab....implants....lots of counseling sessions ....surgery ..and a hell of a lot more courage than I have for her to regain her “center”....

 

That rapist certainly made life itself far more difficult for my sister...it ended her promising career in one field..and she is scarred with the far reaching consequences of his action.  In her view -the considerable physical and emotional trauma which she still battles daily do not define any part of her beyond the word survivor.

 

His violent and ugly self will not taint her legacy in any way.    Her survival is no longer a secret.    One day she stood up publicly and told only enough to be credible -  that she knew first hand what a survivor goes thru.   She has raised an enormous sum of money... founded two major orgaizations to help others and no one is going to crap on her legacy.....

 

The rapist might have found his way and become a decent human being - we don’t know any more than we know your wife’s mother’s story.   I do know other than the time it took to rape  & attempt to kill my sister....however many minutes that was.....that is the ONLY lasting connection.   His legacy good or bad is of his own making.  What he did to my sister may or may not be part of his legacy.   I have no way to know.  

 

My sister’s legacy is of her own making as well.  Neither of them defines the history of the other.     

 

She sure as hell would never thank him.   She would prosecute him to the full extent if the law if she could have ever had that chance.    But his impact forcing so much to change in her future is not who she is now.  Her success is all about her.  

 

   She took control of her life... looked at the choices left to her and walked away and onto a new road.   Scary, painful, unplanned, but enormously rewarding.   He took much from her.   She thrives because of who she is.... changed forever because of the rape.... but the legacy of her footprint is not tainted by him.... he was a trauma to overcome.   A big one.   But he only is a measure of her strength to win in spite of obstacles.   ( she would likely add like everyone else).   Like your wife - I find both survivors to be amazing people 

 

von

 

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1 hour ago, VonNoble said:

What he did to my sister may or may not be part of his legacy.

It is. Everything you do that effects others is a part of your legacy. You may give pain to one and joy to another. You may create one day and destroy the next. Each act leaves a mark, and those marks spell out your legacy. We are not simple creatures, and that is reflected in the complexity of our legacies.

This point is actually what I meant to illustrate when I brought up my wife's mother. The good we do does not make the bad we do go away. Pencils have erasers but life does not, you know? We can repent, reform, and even attempt recompense, but we can't turn back the clock.

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1 hour ago, VonNoble said:

Hmmm.   Whatever the trauma.   It does not define us necessarily.    

Of course. However, trauma can fundamentally change us. Not always, or even necessarily often. But it can

 And when it does, the universe is robbed of the chance to know the person we could have been.

Innocence doesn't grow back. And that is true both for victim and victimizer.

 

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