You Know I Am Worried

[Pete]

Hi folks, I am worried about something that is happening in the UK. There has been a number of horses which have been ritually attacked in places throughout the UK over the recent decades. It usually occurs at a full moon and near to pagan and Wicca celebration dates. The problem is the press and others are being quoted in saying that this is the work of Witches. I know that witches would never do such a thing as it is beyond their beliefs to harm anything but I feel that unless people point out to others being fed by the press, there maybe a backlash directed at Wiccans for something I do not believe they have anything to do with.

(I warn you this report is not pleasant to read) :- http://travel.aol.co.uk/2013/07/26/pony-killed-satanic-ritual-devon-national-park/

I am not a Witch or a Wiccan but I believe in my friends who are and wonder if people could use their persuasive influence to point out to those who say they plan to attack witches that they are mistaken.

Wiccans believe that what harm you do to others will come back three fold to themselves. Wiccans do not believe the christian figure of Satan exists let alone worship Satan. Wiccans do not sacrifice any living creature and certainly will be appalled by this report as I am. The trouble is (IMO) there are many who do not bother to learn what others believe and seem too quick to give them the blame for something that has nothing to do with them.

[grateful]

what a horrible story pete! on wednesday I had the pleasure of meeting a three month old foal, that wanted to do nothing more than kiss me and nibble my shirt sleeve..

what brings a person to look into the eyes of a baby creature and think, yes, I will kill him, and cut off his ear and his genitals? I'm having trouble wishing less on the perpetrators

and thanks for reminding of wicca's disdain for cruelty

Edited August 2, 2013 by grateful

[Atwater Vitki]

Pete -

You are right, disturbing, very disturbing reading. Once again fear based idiotic behavior by the few is being blamed on those we do not understand. The quote by the animal officer "witches or devil worshippers" ? or perhaps just a group of drunk policemen or maybe even a small, disturbed group of malcontented jockeys tired of losing horse races or aliens! That iT! It was the aliens using horse now instead of the cows previously mutilated in the US!....or a sick s.o.b.... or....or....or...???

The bottom line is that until the very sick person or persons involved are found and properly convicted of this cruelty, we'll never know.

Perhaps we might ask that everyone, in whatever form of "prayer" they are accustom to, pray for the souls of those responsible that they will soon be held accountable for their actions and be shown the mercy of the magistrate they were unable to afford this poor animal. I agree Grateful, it's very difficult to express "mercy" and not want the same for those responsible...however...well you know what I mean. It is so terribly difficult to express love, compassion and understanding towards those that would do such an inhumane thing to any living creature...maybe our prayer should be they suffer consciousness of their conscience? That those responsible suffer the same shear terror that foal did before afforded mercy.

Frankly, just coming in from the garage, it's difficult not to want to use our pruning shears for another form of "growth" and the box of canning jars not be used for another sort of "berry"....(very small "berries" if you ask me on someone able to commit such a horrific act...I think the tiny, ½ cup canning jar would suffice!)

Prayers of conscious,

Blessings of Peace,

[Pete]

I think that is the problem. It is a sick and painful to read story and I cannot for the life of me understand how someone can do such a thing. The problem is the story can easily and understandably bring angry responses in people and I worry that the wrong people are going to get blamed for this. Thus making this tragic and sickening story even worse (if that can be said). I have looked at other cases and they range in many parts of England, Wales, Scotland and Ireland. I also read that there have been a few incidents like this in the US. I fear the ill informed person hurt by these stories are going to go looking for a culprit and in their ignorance pick on the wrong victims as the press appears to have done. It is scary that there are people who could actually do this to any living creature but it is also scary (IMO) to think where this can lead given that witches are wrongly being blamed by the (IMO) ignorant press.

[Atwater Vitki]

Bingo Pete.

I've told my story on the forum how I was mistaken for a "Satanic worshiper" by members of the LDS because I had "Welcome and Peace to all who enter here!" ("Welcome and Peace to all who enter here!") painted in runes on my front stonewall when I lived in Willow Creek. Their ignorance of my beliefs nearly caused a huge upset within the community if it were not for folks who already knew the truth. Pony mutilation and ritualistic killing is a far greater issue from mere painted rocks, but the results can be even more catastrophic due to the heinous nature of this crime.

I'm afraid I know folks who would act first and ask questions later if they even suspected someone of such atrocities as that.

Yes, it is indeed so unsettling, not to mention how difficult it is, to ask for prayers of healing for the people involved in that terrible act of vicious cruelty towards an animal... and a pony to boot! However, if we truly believe in and respect Peace, Love and Harmony, we must start somewhere, even with such a terrible thing as this.

Whether or not it will truly make a difference, I stopped what I was doing and went to my alter, lit candles and sent an earnest prayer into the Cosmos that these people will be held accountable for their actions and find peace in their minds and hearts....will my single prayer be cause for action? perhaps not. Will prayers from many? Perhaps so. Let us each do what is in our hearts, not minds, to pro-actively and creatively prevent such an egregious act of shear horrific inhumanity from ever happening again.

Blessings of Peace,

Blessings Be,

So Be It

(Goodness! This would be such a GREAT planet if it weren't for all the dang people on it!!)

[Pete]

100% with you AV. Amen my friend.

[Bro. Hex]

100% with you AV. Amen my friend.

[Gryffythe]

Perhaps we might ask that everyone, in whatever form of "prayer" they are accustom to, pray for the souls of those responsible that they will soon be held accountable for their actions and be shown the mercy of the magistrate they were unable to afford this poor animal.

Count me in!

[Dan56]

Perhaps we might ask that everyone, in whatever form of "prayer" they are accustom to, pray for the souls of those responsible that they will soon be held accountable for their actions and be shown the mercy of the magistrate they were unable to afford this poor animal.

Count me in!

Count me out.... Mercy, love, and prayers for people who commit such horrific acts will simply promote more of the same. Pacifism doesn't deter crime, it promotes, encourages, and enables it.

[Atwater Vitki]

Count me out.... Mercy, love, and prayers for people who commit such horrific acts will simply promote more of the same. Pacifism doesn't deter crime, it promotes, encourages, and enables it.

Really Dan?

Count you out that these perpetrators will be held accountable for their actions and find peace in their minds and hearts. Really?

I must say I am shocked. This is not a call for pacifism, it is a prayer that they will be brought to justice and then find the peace the Creator can give....not wipe the slate clean and they continue to do such things.

Blessings be,

[Dan56]

Really Dan?

Count you out that these perpetrators will be held accountable for their actions and find peace in their minds and hearts. Really?

I must say I am shocked. This is not a call for pacifism, it is a prayer that they will be brought to justice and then find the peace the Creator can give....not wipe the slate clean and they continue to do such things.

Blessings be,

I read it differently I guess? It sounded like a wish that a magistrate (judge) would be more merciful towards the perpetrators than they were towards the colt? I interpreted "merciful" as letting bygones be bygones, a forgive and forget scenario. To me, being held accountable is being punished for your crime, while hoping a judge is merciful is tantamount to wishing that the offenders get off easy. That's why I chimed-in with a "Count me out". Sorry if I misread the meaning of your post, it just makes me angry to hear of severe animal abuse, and I don't care about the "peace of mind" of those who committed this dastardly deed. In fact, I'd prefer they'd have a troubled mind about what they did.

[Raincloud]

The foundations of the Christian religion were built on animal sacrifices. The whole blood of the Lamb thing. Without sacrificing the Blood of the Lamb (Jesus) there would be no Christian symbolism.

So it's not just an ancient pagan thing. We may think it's sinister, by the bible is full of heros sacrificing innocent animals.

My guess it's a couple of young psychos having pseudo satanic rituals to look cool.

That being said, A chicken was sacrificed for my dinner tonight.

[Pete]

Please be warned that this post has some horrible descriptions of cruelty in it.

I think I can understand Dan's point though. It is one thing to kill an animal quickly and painless, say for your meal, but as in this case chopping off its ear, cutting out the eyes and also mutilating its private parts, cutting out its tongue and putting this animal through a long sustained torture till death, is plain sick and the culprits need to be dealt with very severely by the law. One can also understand why some want to turn vigilante. The trouble is I believe they are portioning the blame where is does not belong. Witches and Satanist would never do such a thing. This is the work of psychopaths as anyone else would find this story hard emotionally to read let alone carry out such an evil action.

[Atwater Vitki]

Believe me Dan, nothing makes me more furious than child or animal abusers.

Through the anger and heated exchanges of things in this world it is often difficult to remember "What Would Jesus Do?" or any other peace maker. As a matter of fact, I'd hate to think what would happen to such a person if they were caught in the act by many of our animal lovers here on the forum...I doubt if the cruelty of what happened to that poor pony would suffice to described the encounter.

However, that's part of my point. Our knee-gut reaction is "dole out worse" while our Spiritual and "God/Creator" loving Nature should be to dole out justice with love and peaceful intentions. It situations like this that truly test our commitment to His Love.

And yes, Pete, I totally agree pointing the blame at the wrong party is another part of this equation. As of right now, no one knows if it's a Satanic ritual or just a twisted vicar acting out. Until the the responsible party(ies) are caught all group labels should be left out of media reports.

Blessings of Peace,

Edited August 5, 2013 by Atwater Vitki

[Songster]

Count me out.... Mercy, love, and prayers for people who commit such horrific acts will simply promote more of the same. Pacifism doesn't deter crime, it promotes, encourages, and enables it.

My friend.... this has to be the most un-Christian post submitted by you... Isn't the Christ's message of forgiveness and mercy extended to all? ("Peter, put away your sword.")

Edited August 6, 2013 by Songster

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

My sense of things is that these crimes were committed by people who are evil, stupid and ignorant. Either they thought their ritual was "cool" -- or worse -- they wanted their crimes blamed on the innocent.

Note please -- I said: evil, stupid and ignorant. Not sick. Not all awful things are done by sick people. Sometimes, they are evil. there is a difference.

[Dan56]

My friend.... this has to be the most un-Christian post submitted by you... Isn't the Christ's message of forgiveness and mercy extended to all? ("Peter, put away your sword.")

There's nothing non-Christian about hating an act of inhumane violence. "Hate the evil, and love the good" (Amos 5:15). God's forgiveness does not extend to the unrepentant or those who don't ask to be forgiven.

My point was that when you have mercy on, or forgive the unrepentant, your pretty much endorsing and promoting their sin, and God hates sin. Jesus didn't have much mercy when he chased the moneychangers out of the temple with a whip. And Jesus asked Peter to put away his sword because Peter was interfering with Christ mission.

This is just my more conservative view, and I know it flies against the view that many Christians have of an all-forgiving lovey-dovey God. Vengeance is God's, and its His promise that unrepentant people who commit these brutal crimes will become the object of His wrath, and I take solace in that.

[Pete]

My sense of things is that these crimes were committed by people who are evil, stupid and ignorant. Either they thought their ritual was "cool" -- or worse -- they wanted their crimes blamed on the innocent.

Note please -- I said: evil, stupid and ignorant. Not sick. Not all awful things are done by sick people. Sometimes, they are evil. there is a difference.

I spoke of sick in the sense of revulsion rather than declaring these persons as ill. They maybe but I just do not know that.

[Fawzo]

There's nothing non-Christian about hating an act of inhumane violence. "Hate the evil, and love the good" (Amos 5:15). God's forgiveness does not extend to the unrepentant or those who don't ask to be forgiven.

My point was that when you have mercy on, or forgive the unrepentant, your pretty much endorsing and promoting their sin, and God hates sin. Jesus didn't have much mercy when he chased the moneychangers out of the temple with a whip. And Jesus asked Peter to put away his sword because Peter was interfering with Christ mission.

This is just my more conservative view, and I know it flies against the view that many Christians have of an all-forgiving lovey-dovey God. Vengeance is God's, and its His promise that unrepentant people who commit these brutal crimes will become the object of His wrath, and I take solace in that.

Daniel claimed ..."My point was that when you have mercy on, or forgive the unrepentant, your pretty much endorsing and promoting their sin, and God hates sin......tell me again why Jesus came and died such a horrible death?!?!!?!

[Dan56]

Daniel claimed ..."My point was that when you have mercy on, or forgive the unrepentant, your pretty much endorsing and promoting their sin, and God hates sin......tell me again why Jesus came and died such a horrible death?!?!!?!

Jesus said; "Thus it is written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem" (Luke 24:46-47), "Unless you repent, you will likewise perish" (Luke 13:3), "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel" (Mark 1:15), "I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance" (Mark 2:17). I'm surprised you didn't know that?

Edited August 8, 2013 by Dan56