Salvation for Fallen Humans & Fallen Angels (A Practical Guide)

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

2 hours ago, RevBogovac said:

 

 

Nice deflection Dan... the point is that if you do not understand basic principles you are not even coming close to understanding higher principles...

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dan56]

8 hours ago, RevBogovac said:

Nice deflection Dan... the point is that if you do not understand basic principles you are not even coming close to understanding higher principles...

 

Deflection? I was discussing the belief in spirituality and somehow you switched that subject to astronomy? 

As you stated, belief is a philosophical topic, so I don't see the relevance of comparing it to something you can study by gazing through a telescope in your backyard.

Yes, people die, stars die, etc, but God is Spirit, and its that spiritual side of humans that escapes you.

[mark 45]

everything is energy in one form or another,so when something "dies"it just turns into a different form.

4 hours ago, Dan56 said:

 

Deflection? I was discussing the belief in spirituality and somehow you switched that subject to astronomy? 

As you stated, belief is a philosophical topic, so I don't see the relevance of comparing it to something you can study by gazing through a telescope in your backyard.

Yes, people die, stars die, etc, but God is Spirit, and its that spiritual side of humans that escapes you.

 

Edited April 9, 2019 by mark 45

[Dan56]

52 minutes ago, mark 45 said:

everything is energy in one form or another,so when something "dies"it just turns into a different form.

 

 

I don't believe that's applicable to a spirit. How does a spirit die? Does it die? According to the bible it doesn't, and that's my simple point. 

[RevBogovac]

15 hours ago, Dan56 said:

 

Deflection? I was discussing the belief in spirituality and somehow you switched that subject to astronomy? 

As you stated, belief is a philosophical topic, so I don't see the relevance of comparing it to something you can study by gazing through a telescope in your backyard.

Yes, people die, stars die, etc, but God is Spirit, and its that spiritual side of humans that escapes you.

 

It is the fact that you first have to grasp physics, before you can begin to understand metaphysics, that escapes you...

 

You're talking about mythology, not spirituality, let alone philosophy... 

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

52 minutes ago, RevBogovac said:

 

It is the fact that you first have to grasp physics, before you can begin to understand metaphysics, that escapes you...

 

You're talking about mythology, not spirituality, let alone philosophy... 

 

 

You're trying to make distinctions?  With Dan?  Have you been watching my efforts?     

 

 

[Key]

On 4/9/2019 at 12:15 AM, Dan56 said:

 

I don't disagree, nearly everyone dies physically.. But I was speaking spiritually.. Tell me how astronomy addresses spiritual death? And I don't mean the mere transformation of energy,  because it fails to address your consciousness, and that's why I wrote that the limitations of secular thinking makes it a dead end street. 

 

 

Curious. Can anyone prove that consciousness isn't possibly energy, itself? Just a thought, that hadn't occurred to me before.

[Key]

16 hours ago, Dan56 said:

 

I don't believe that's applicable to a spirit. How does a spirit die? Does it die? According to the bible it doesn't, and that's my simple point. 

Actually, Dan, it does. Why else would it say that it isn't God's wish that anyone should perish? If the spirit is immortal, then no one would really perish, right? Then God would have no need to present such a claim.

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

2 hours ago, Key said:

Curious. Can anyone prove that consciousness isn't possibly energy, itself? Just a thought, that hadn't occurred to me before.

 

 

It is possible to be alive without being conscious.  No humor intended.  This is what happens during surgery, under anaesthesia.

[RevBogovac]

3 hours ago, Key said:

Curious. Can anyone prove that consciousness isn't possibly energy, itself? Just a thought, that hadn't occurred to me before.

 

If we look at consciousness as a function of the brain, than it is exactly that: energy. The brain functions by "firing neurons" which is energy transfer... When you are unconscious, the neurons aren't firing...

[cuchulain]

Spirit, if it exists, is clearly malleable through physical means.  If it were the essence of you and immortal, how would you explain the difference in person when they received a labotomy?

Edited April 10, 2019 by cuchulain
Sp

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

This conversation is going off the deep end, because we don't know what we are talking about.

 

Spirit -- what ever that is -- may or may not exist.  That is what we know.  That we don't know.  Unless someone actually has hard evidence?  Objective, verifiable facts?

 

In the absence of facts, all we have is speculation and opinion.

 

 

 

 

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

On 4/10/2019 at 6:22 AM, RevBogovac said:

 

It is the fact that you first have to grasp physics, before you can begin to understand metaphysics, that escapes you...

 

You're talking about mythology, not spirituality, let alone philosophy... 

 

Metaphysics?     

 

When prune juice and fiber don't work -- we take a metaphysic?     

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 12, 2019 by Jonathan H. B. Lobl

[Dan56]

On 4/10/2019 at 5:22 AM, RevBogovac said:

 

It is the fact that you first have to grasp physics, before you can begin to understand metaphysics, that escapes you...

 

You're talking about mythology, not spirituality, let alone philosophy... 

 

I was talking about spirituality, although I understand that its mythological to you. The soul is the nonphysical essence of your being (who you are), and the spirit is the intellect or consciousness of your soul.  Tell me how metaphysics explains intangible things like spirit, soul, love, hate? If your thoughts are the result of energy transferred between neuron cells in the brain, what do those thoughts become when the brain dies? 

 

On 4/10/2019 at 12:18 PM, Key said:

Actually, Dan, it does. Why else would it say that it isn't God's wish that anyone should perish? If the spirit is immortal, then no one would really perish, right? Then God would have no need to present such a claim.

 

A spirit can't be killed by conventional means, only God can destroy it. While its not His desire, the bible says it will be a reality. A spirit is only immortal until God decides otherwise, "And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell" (Matthew 10:28)
 

[RevBogovac]

7 hours ago, Dan56 said:

 

I was talking about spirituality, although I understand that its mythological to you. [...]

 

 

No. The book you are using to "prove" your thoughts on "spirituality" is myth. It doesn't even understand basic concepts on day and night but you insist it is 100% true. It is not. Only to fundamentalists. It's mythology.

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

4 hours ago, RevBogovac said:

 

No. The book you are using to "prove" your thoughts on "spirituality" is myth. It doesn't even understand basic concepts on day and night but you insist it is 100% true. It is not. Only to fundamentalists. It's mythology.

 

 

I know.  It's hard to walk away.     

 

Faith is impervious to reason.  Reason bounces off a Fundamentalist, like water off a duck.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 12, 2019 by Jonathan H. B. Lobl

[Dan56]

5 hours ago, RevBogovac said:

 

No. The book you are using to "prove" your thoughts on "spirituality" is myth. It doesn't even understand basic concepts on day and night but you insist it is 100% true. It is not. Only to fundamentalists. It's mythology.

 

I believe its 100% true, so yes, its not mythology to me. It certainly explains a lot of things that science has no answers for. And night/day aren't concepts hard to grasp, so perhaps God didn't deem it necessary to explain it more than He did. "And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night... And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also" (Genesis 1:4-5 &16).
 

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

7 minutes ago, Dan56 said:

 

I believe its 100% true, so yes, its not mythology to me. It certainly explains a lot of things that science has no answers for. And night/day aren't concepts hard to grasp, so perhaps God didn't deem it necessary to explain it more than He did. "And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night... And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also" (Genesis 1:4-5 &16).
 

 

 

Yes.  Of course.  The Creation of Earth was a six day project.

 

he made the stars also"

 

Of course.  What more is there to say?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[cuchulain]

Still waiting to hear about labotomies and how they physically affect spirit ..

[Dan56]

8 hours ago, cuchulain said:

Still waiting to hear about labotomies and how they physically affect spirit ..

 

Lobotomies were used to treat a variety of mental illnesses and psychiatric problems, so I doubt it would interfere with a persons spirit? Might change a persons demeanor, depression,, or pain, but I don't know enough about them to comment on the affect on someones spirit.