Welfare

[Brother Kaman]

And personally why work if the government will give me a check, SNAP, Medicaid, a free cell phone and charities are happy to toss in aid if I really would rather not?

And that is it in a nutshell, isn't it? Why work if the "government" will give me a check? Last time I looked the "government" was the people. That means, why work if I and other's like me will support you. Why, indeed.

[kokigami]

still, there are at least two salient points in there. One is that he is mostly unemployable. Not that he can't work, necessarily, but that few would hire him, when there are others, more capable, to hire. Which leads to a second point, that he is unlikely to make a living wage at any job he might be able to get. These are both problems that arise from a work force that is too large for demand.

It is a sensible, and financially sound decision at an individual level. But on an aggregate level, it creates a tension that puts the system at risk, if too many people make it. Much like the anti vaxers put the general health at risk.

It is not like no contribution is being made to the social matrix. Buskers, at least good ones, help to make a locality unique, and of interest to visitors, at least. They are a mixed blessing, however, as some hate them. (at least it isn't street mime, eh?)

[panpareil]

There is no demand for a worker who does nothing anybody wants. The solution is the altruistic idea of doing what someone else wants to have done, not the selfish idea of doing what you want to do. This also entails the altruistic idea of devoting your life to the learning of how to fulfill the needs of others, otherwise known as successfully acquiring an education in practical and marketable skills,.

[Brother Kaman]

still, there are at least two salient points in there. One is that he is mostly unemployable. Not that he can't work, necessarily, but that few would hire him, when there are others, more capable, to hire. Which leads to a second point, that he is unlikely to make a living wage at any job he might be able to get. These are both problems that arise from a work force that is too large for demand.

It is a sensible, and financially sound decision at an individual level. But on an aggregate level, it creates a tension that puts the system at risk, if too many people make it. Much like the anti vaxers put the general health at risk.

It is not like no contribution is being made to the social matrix. Buskers, at least good ones, help to make a locality unique, and of interest to visitors, at least. They are a mixed blessing, however, as some hate them. (at least it isn't street mime, eh?)

As far as I am concerned, the sentence I quoted says it all.

There is no demand for a worker who does nothing anybody wants. The solution is the altruistic idea of doing what someone else wants to have done, not the selfish idea of doing what you want to do. This also entails the altruistic idea of devoting your life to the learning of how to fulfill the needs of others, otherwise known as successfully acquiring an education in practical and marketable skills,.

Exactly.

[Dr Kevin James DD]

There are people who genuinely need help, but there are others who exploit the system. My nephew gets $200 of food stamps a month, phone, etc. He's a bum, a healthy 35 yr old man who has a sense of entitlement. I've offered him a good job 3 times and he rejected me 3 times. He won't work because he doesn't have to work and isn't required to accept work. Its people like him that give the truly needy a bad rap. When I tell him that he needs to get a job, his response is; "Why?" I must confess, he has a valid point, he gets along very well without working.

"For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat." (2 Thessalonians 3:10)

There are people who genuinely need help, but there are others who exploit the system. My nephew gets $200 of food stamps a month, phone, etc. He's a bum, a healthy 35 yr old man who has a sense of entitlement. I've offered him a good job 3 times and he rejected me 3 times. He won't work because he doesn't have to work and isn't required to accept work. Its people like him that give the truly needy a bad rap. When I tell him that he needs to get a job, his response is; "Why?" I must confess, he has a valid point, he gets along very well without working.

"For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat." (2 Thessalonians 3:10)

+1 !! Excellent point Brother!! The scripture you gave is exactly what I was thinking!! There are many scriptures in the book of Proverbs, concerning the lazy and those that don't work! Then there's that old saying, " An idle mind is the Devil's workshop!!

Edited April 18, 2014 by KevinJames

[lordie]

Actually people make 189 for one person on foodstamps 250 for two people .and i don't believe this thread .no one knows what their future holds and you all pick on people on welfare and ssi and snap . why? you all don't know what situation any one is enduring until you walk a mile in their shoes . i have a friend that was desperate for. money that he almost killed me to get the bond money my old sis put on my head . (Order a hit) but he didn't .i forgave him he ask me why i said i dont know what i would do In your shoes .and he goes do you know why i did that i said yes your dad died .and you were responsible for the furneral .he went yes .he end up saving my life from another kidnapp attempt from my old sis . and he made sure i had a true friend in him .so you say what happen to him now

or were is he .he died and no one was allowed to attend his furneral . i tel you all one thing i loved that man and i loved his family .and i always tell people what he did not in details . I was the only person who love him like no other .

i walk in his shoes about two years ago when my dad died .i sold my home and sold the family business to pay my dad furneral .you say why didn't my friend do the same he couldn't there was no home there was no business .for him

To sell .

he made me realize that no matter who you are or were you been you haven't walk a mile in no one shoes until it happens to you

remember that!!!!

lordie

p.s. i even married my friend that's a friend i will never forget him .

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

I just got done look at the news wheel on a social network site were they had about foodstamps and a iphone

I thought well so what someone on foodstamps has an iphone no big deal they aint that expensive . And so i read the comments unbelievable the hatred towards people on welfare and foodstamps . It turned my stomache . As religious people we shouldnt make fun of any one esp one that is different than us .

So i posted a comment

You dont know someone until you walk a mile in their shoes !!

I thought well it might stop the picking i guess i wasnt the only one who thought that some other people did too . My personal belief is dont judge because someday it might be you

Lordie

A moment of reality, if you please. Due to my low income, I got my "Obama phone" this past March. It is NOT a smart phone. It is NOT an I-phone. It is a cheaply made, poor quality "Safe-Link Trac Phone." It came with 253 minutes. I have not yet been able to get my 250 April minutes. There is no roll-over. Unused minutes are gone. It will not do anything with the internet. No music. No e-mail. No web. No games. No any other frills.

That's it. The wonder and the glory of the free Obama phone. Give it a rest. It's better than nothing, but not by much. It is not the fantasy smart phone that people seem to be imagining.

[lordie]

I agree jonathan

i had an obama phone in the '90's

i also had safelink my minutes at the time rollover .years later i didn't qualify for the progrAm then about a year ago i qualified for assurance wireless i agree it is better than nothing .i used it and do u qualify for pcap it might help u as well . just a thought . The problem w theses phone is that my mom who made less than me couldn't get the safelink but i could i felt bad and so my mom and i shared my phone i was my parents caregiver . even tho we tried no one gave her one even when she move to another town still didn't qualify i go what she is partial blind .but that what they said . I felt so bad lucky i had an old cell i gave it to my mom a tracfone just in case one day she called me it came in handy .now my mom has dementia .

I am also low income i live in non goverment housing . and even tho people pick on others my belief is don't pick unless u walked in their shoes

people pick on me i wear braces on my legs aka afo i also have an eye condition. and nerve problem . Somedays i haved wonder what are churches teaching or school when we or anyone gets picked on. think about it

[ClericThomas]

The free cell phone is a PHONE, what do you expect, can you make calls with it if so its working. I have a basic Tracphone now and its acceptable and I only receive and make calls, text and have voice mail that is more than enough.

In my case my main skills is Busking, I might work 40 hours and get $100 on most weeks. $400 a month. A couple days a year better. So for me the $721 a month on SSI, Medicaid, food stamps, a cell phone is very attractive to me. What is said when I Busked in Europe I was treated as an Artist and tipped well I made in todays dollars around $2000 a month and got free meals, housing and other things as I traveled around here in this area I'm a bit better than a panhandler and well it shows. I even had people throw hot coffee, beer bottles and other things at me.

[Youch]

A moment of reality, if you please. Due to my low income, I got my "Obama phone" this past March. It is NOT a smart phone. It is NOT an I-phone. It is a cheaply made, poor quality "Safe-Link Trac Phone." It came with 253 minutes. I have not yet been able to get my 250 April minutes. There is no roll-over. Unused minutes are gone. It will not do anything with the internet. No music. No e-mail. No web. No games. No any other frills.

That's it. The wonder and the glory of the free Obama phone. Give it a rest. It's better than nothing, but not by much. It is not the fantasy smart phone that people seem to be imagining.

The wonder and glory of the free Obama phone? You mean the blatant attempt to buy votes with such a frivolous thing as extreme deficit spending?

Sorry I didn't buy you a better phone.

i had an obama phone in the '90's

The term "obama" has penetrated the lexicon now to include/invade/rewrite culture from 20 years ago??

Obama phone in the '90s, really?

In my case my main skills is Busking, I might work 40 hours and get $100 on most weeks. $400 a month. A couple days a year better. So for me the $721 a month on SSI, Medicaid, food stamps, a cell phone is very attractive to me. What is said when I Busked in Europe I was treated as an Artist and tipped well I made in todays dollars around $2000 a month and got free meals, housing and other things as I traveled around here in this area I'm a bit better than a panhandler and well it shows. I even had people throw hot coffee, beer bottles and other things at me.

Busker, it seems an unsustainably poor choice of profession and years of enabled dependency leaves you either unwilling or unable to change the situation. Either way we seem to be inextricably connected in a manner found not at all in nature.....and the fact that you get the better end of the deal doesn't seem to bother your growing ranks near as much as my dwindling one. But to quote Mrs. Thatcher, "socialism works great until you run out of other people's money." So, enjoy it while you can.

[Atwater Vitki]

T..... as I traveled around here in this area I'm a bit better than a panhandler and well it shows. I even had people throw hot coffee, beer bottles and other things at me.

You have my curiosity up...just what type of performance were you doing to incite the assault of hot liquids and glass bottles upon your person? I don't want to jump to conclusions about your performance ability prior to inquiring, but the assaults you suggest, though certainly not proper, are generally indicative of very poor acting/performance.. etc or of being on the brash side of things.

Blessings of Peace,

[revtimothybland]

My wife stole my keyboard:

To begin, I have read all 5 pages of this particular forum. I've watched as the discussion went from "Should we look down upon others?" to "We should" and then, "Well, no, we really shouldn't (in this case)" to "You're a lazy POS!" and others along the same vein.

I'm an incredibly lucky woman. I was able to work, though it wasn't at the same job, and I did spend a few (cumulative) years unable to find a job, but I was able to work for the minimum amount of time required to qualify for a program called SSDI, where I actually will get back the money I paid in taxes to the Social Security Administration. It's not much, but it helps pay the rent, and my husband works a full-time job. While most people assume that working a full-time job indicates that you have plenty of money, that is not the case by far.

Because of the new healthcare law, my husband's paychecks (one every 2 weeks) gross nearly double his net (take-home) pay. We never see that money. Just under $300 every 2 weeks is removed from his paycheck before he gets it. We can't afford to actually use the insurance, because the co-pay is ridiculous. I grant we have options, but the new healthcare law limits us in so many ways that we'd be better off not having insurance & paying out-of-pocket for everything.

We don't qualify for Food Stamps, or SNAP Benefits, or anything else for that matter, because my husband grosses over $1000 a month. That brings our combined total to just over the "qualifying" amount. We have just enough to pay bills. Not really enough to buy groceries. We live in an apartment, so we can't have a garden. We can't afford a gun (not even a handgun) so getting a hunting license is redundant.

We used to get food stamps. We celebrated the day we no longer qualified. We had no idea that we'd be struggling so much to just barely make it by without them, but we're not destitute yet.

Now, as to the rest: Atwater Vitki, My husband speaks highly of you. You're not a total idiot. You seem to have a good general grasp of how the world works, and how broken the system is. I appreciate your insights, and your refusal to commit fraud. (I've been on the other side of that, where people have offered me money in exchange for the food stamps we had to hoard or starve, & I saw how angry they were when I refused.) You do seem to have a biased opinion of people who get public assistance, and you're entitled to that. You've probably seen a lot of people who abuse the system. It can make a non-judgemental person somewhat biased.

BP, You're in a home you "own". Therefore, you cannot qualify for any public assistance programs. Grow a garden, get a few rabbits & chickens & put them in cages, and ask anyone who is willing to assist you to do so, in exchange for a portion of the harvest. Learn how to can & put up your harvest. Because, dude, you're so mired right now. All because you're living the "American Dream" of owning your own home.

Lordie, Get an education. If your manner of speech is anything like your writng style, then, child, you need to learn English. You write like an undereducated high-school dropout. Now before you get all upset, let me help you with that. I'M A HIGH SCHOOL DROPOUT. Not because I was undereducated, but because the curriculum didn't meet my needs & was preventing me from going to college. I started college the very next semester. If you have the option, go back to school. It will help you a lot in the short & long terms. You don't even have to go to a physical school. There are many options for going to school online that will assist you. And if you have a library card, you can go to your local library for classes. Your tale of woe is one I have heard many times. "It's not my fault." "I didn't cause this." Yeah, you didn't see the situation for what it was, either. You may not have put yourself into this, but you haven't done enough to get out of it.

Youch, you're acting like one of those people who maintains a keg just south of his chest and gets paid $25 an hour to yell at people. We're not here to be condemned, nor are we here to be vindicated, condoned, or ordered around. We're here to share our views, air our opinions, and generally add to the raucous. (That's pronounced ruckus) I understand your need to generally gripe and complain about all "those people" who "take your money" and do whatever the hell they wish with it, but they've been doing that since the day you started paying taxes to a corrupted system anyway, so you can't really logically complain about it without giving credence to the corrupt system you keep feeding, now can you? Chew on that while you formulate a reply.

ClericThomas, your attitude is the reason you've had so many people up in arms about your situation. Nobody likes a loafer. You have a legitimate medical problem that prevents you from having a "regular" job or being employed by the majority of employers. If you truly didn't like to work, you'd never get out of bed. It's not easy to crawl out of bed. Most people do it every day. Apparently, even you do. So to say you don't like to work is actually untrue. You crawled out of bed & got dressed this morning, didn't you? Remember this statement a wise man once made: If have a job you love, you'll never work a day in your life.

Panpareil, Brother Kaman, Jonathan H. B. Lobl, Kevin James, you all have aspects of the situation in the right perspective. Now the four of you need to sit down & talk.

Kokigami, there aren't very many people in this world at whom I can point & say "HE GETS IT!" You are one of those people. Thank you.

Now, To reiterate: I am not Reverend Timothy Bland. I am his wife. (High Priestess Cat Bland) So please do not direct your comments to my husband. He's not going to happy with me as it is. Let him know first and foremost it is I you are directing your comments to.

I have had fibromyalgia since I was a child. I was first diagnosed at the age of 14 by a nurse, who was told by a doctor that (popular belief at the time, ruled Medical Fact) it didn't affect any female under the age of 40. When I was 18, another nurse, and the doctor she was associated with, ruled out any possible causes of my symptoms except fibromyalgia, but (again, popular belief, commonly called Medical Fact) it didn't affect anyone as young as I. When I was 27, the pain got so bad, so unbearable, that I went to a doctor and begged for an end of the torment. He said, "Oh, it's normal. Lots of women your age and younger have fibromyalgia." I continued to work when, and for as long as, I could. I concentrated on my hobbies when I couldn't work.

I have a lot of hobbies. I have a lot of "useless skills" that don't make me specifically "employable" but I do have a lot of fun things to do when my legs won't work, or my back feels as if I've been run over by a steamroller, or my body simply refuses to comply with what my mind is telling it to do. I can do many things. I can't do them all perfectly, nor can I claim to be the fastest hobbyist on the planet, but I know how to teach as well as how to use my skills. I don't have a lot of money, and I doubt I ever will have. I don't really care. Money's overrated. It's like skin color. You either have it, or you don't, and those that have it get certain benefits from it. Oh well.

Oh, yeah, and I fought a corrupt system that based my disability determination on my age and previous work history without asking me or my doctors anything about my condition. They sent me to their doctors, who were paid to give a biased (aka false) opinion of the situation. I won after FIVE years. I can walk a mile. I won't be able to walk more than a tenth of that for the next day or two, but I can walk a mile. I wasn't yet 30 when I first applied and was denied several times due to my age. I was 33 when I finally was able to be seen by an arbiter, who saw me, pain and all. That was the only time that I spoke to a live human being who was not paid to deny the truth about the situation.

No, I don't use the system. I don't condemn those who need it. I don't condone those who abuse it. I don't care what their skin color, age, or level of education is. Need is not want, & abuse is a crime.

Before I go, I would like each and every one of you to check out this link. It's a solid line in the sand, if you will.

Edited May 7, 2014 by revtimothybland

[revtimothybland]

On a lighter note, I had left this page up this morning because I wasn't done reading it all before I had to go to work. My wife saw it, read it, and the above is the result.

While I don't agree 100% with her assessments above, I can say that I believe that she has been very blunt and honest, and I would like to appologize if it upsets anyone, but it is her opinion, nothing more.

[Atwater Vitki]

On a lighter note, I had left this page up this morning because I wasn't done reading it all before I had to go to work. My wife saw it, read it, and the above is the result.

While I don't agree 100% with her assessments above, I can say that I believe that she has been very blunt and honest, and I would like to appologize if it upsets anyone, but it is her opinion, nothing more.

And...it was refreshing indeed. Thank you High Priestess Cat Bland for your 3½¢ worth of "opinion" I am certain there will those who will retort horrendously, but I repeat, I found your response refreshing, honest and very on point to the responses to this topic. Anyone who feels they received a bit of a bashing or harsh opinion, perhaps think about what was said before over reacting like she said. We all learn from the honest assessments of others, even total strangers. If we can't take a bit of critique then we've made the conscious choice to stop growing as a person and that too is "unacceptable" in my book.

Timothy, if you didn't know it before, you should know it now...you have a wonderful partner in life on many levels...as they say in some parts o' da world.."You gots yursef a keeper!"

Blessings of Peace,

Edited May 8, 2014 by Atwater Vitki

[lordie]

To rev tims wife

actually u are right i did quit school i am a abuse survivor from rape to beatens to molestation i was torture raped and dragged across many floors .i write this way cause i rather enjoy it it is called free thought .w out punctuation and as a thought not as a story i read ur feed back ti my post i must say i know how u feel .and just so everyone knows i did recently graduate high school plus college even tho it is wrong to proof anything to anyone .cause we don't have to prove

i am going to say this i am a graduate of many religious studies and classes i graduate them before high school i have an iq over 190. yes i do i can and do practically any theology career but i choose to be a minister w a mda advocate background plus an ada graduate .so i kinda know more than i show in my post which until now everyone enjoyed.i am also disabled and w a unknown neuro musclar disorder . i also have atrophy in both eyes .so yea i post strange but it is me no one else .and. i know what it is like living from check to check .esp. when my folks raised me on 200 a month a feet in the '80's .and not only that my mom and i took up baby sitting for extra cash . i been thru all kinds of stuff that no one actually will imagine .and yea tim it did upset me in a way but in another i needed to blow off some steem .and just so everyone knows i do get a little tick when someone critiques my work as in have ni clue about me .so i ll give a hint i was a caregiver to my parents for 30 yrs .was a school resource officer and a nurse .i been ministering online and finishing my college catholic degree it ain't easy replacing degrees that my sis stole from me while i was working .

i don't mean to disrespect tim but sometimes when someone speaks or post something bad about a person walk a mile in their shoes .that what this post is about we shouldn't pick or bully after all we don't know the person they pick on life so why pick . i know why some people pick to prove their way is right it ain't only our god we chose is right no one in human nature is right .remember that .

Edited May 8, 2014 by lordie

[lordie]

And another thing i respect all who answer even in a fowl manner .even tho i quit school doesmt mean i am uneducated it just means i wa smart enough to leave an unthinkable citation .that no one can imagine . Unlike most high school quitters i actually critiques the school that abuse me i tell everyone how what when who were day year .yea i get sore when some one calls me uneducated because to me it is just like being in school being called stupid .which as u read i am not .

c i camt take honesr critism neither because it ain't it us shear bullying . just like when i first wrote this thread about an iphone and welfare .when i saw the post on fb i was sooo furious because no one knows or knew what it was like ti be poor they just pick extremely . i prefer not to pick but to keep an open mind about things .as for mrs tim yea i kept an open mind but no i will not tolerate any one saying i am uneducated after all the schooling i have under my belt as long w my life experience which is the best college .

and yea i have the right to be mad because it is wrong and down right idiotic to post against another women .really. come on now .

[revtimothybland]

Lordie, to be fair, my wife grew up in southern Alabama. She absolutely abhors bad grammar, having been around it all her life then hearing intelligent speech right here in Texas.

She's not here right now, but I'm sure she'd be willing to accept your explainations, even if she doesn't fully understand them. We all have our flaws. We can all be a touch judgemental sometimes, even if we normally try not to be. I've had issues with your writting style, mostly due to the fact that I'm trying to write short stories and novels. I never said anything because I was unsure. As weird as it is, it seems coherent. My wife can be a little impatient sometimes.

And Atwater, thanks for that. I've always been pretty proud of my find. Never thought I'd meet someone like her. I was already a Wiccan before I met her, but she showed me a few things about my relgion I didn't realize. Really re-affirmed my faith.

[Brother Kaman]

Lordie, all we have on this forum is the written word. If we wish others to understand us, our ideas and beliefs we must strive to communicate the written word in such a manner as to allow the reader to understand what we are saying. Free thought could very well be a wonderful thing for the writer but for this reader it is barely intelligible. For one to be as educated as you claim you do not seem to care enough about the rest of us to attempt to be understood by us. Is it just easier for you be angry with us than to try to put your education to work in helping us to understand what you are trying to say?

Edited May 8, 2014 by Brother Kaman

[revtimothybland]

That, Brother Kaman, I cannot argue with.

[lordie]

Actually my education consits of many miss writing i wasa school teacher so i can read practically anything as for the southern draw as u all claim u write as it is not really draw so to speak from the south it is. also pa dutch w a southern pa aspect .as to put my education to work lets just say i do .as a person who grew up w many ways of writing i believe in not picking or making fun because we each have our own ways and our own. style . so why pick yea u did . by saying my writing style can not be interepted by u mmmm who needs an education not me .because it is not the education it is the respect we show others i respect others but my writing is my style and if u all cannot go beyond ur own teachings than it ain't me it is u yes u . going beyond what we are taught is using our brains. oh i forget u all don't c that as a challenge or learning .one thing i was taught and i taught is to go beyond ur level of education and listen and look as well as respect yea i taught english and grammer and math and religion . my free thought was express all over the. school and as a student i earn scholarships and as a teacher i taught. the free thinking writing. And some kids were from thesouth . one of my fav teacher was wicca she is the one who taught free thinking and i always got a

and not only a but also an award for using futurist language w my writing .and i also put on a modern. twist . i got more a than most as i remember about ur draw is that no one believes in seeing the writer or imagine the writing . i ws taught in ordinary to read a book get into it .which i do as a writer my self i got lost of people wanted my writings some don't understand my style but loves it anyway. so uf u don't like my writing instead if picking learn it embrace it .u might actually use ur brain

peace

lordie

Edited May 8, 2014 by lordie