Youch

You contradict yourself at least twice, which tells me you are unsure about a lot of things in life. I'd expound, but I'm not sure you're still an active member.......

Make fun of them? Of course not. Discourage dependent behavior? Of course! Eliminate welfare for all but the most dire? An obligation!!!!! But know this, welfare is not a hand-out, it is a payment for votes. The politicians who expand such social programs are motivated by nothing more than that. Take it to the bank.....

Having grown a bit too serious in mid-life, with the exception of a few very brief moments the last decade and a half or so I have not listened to too much music. Precious little, in fact....and then the other day, while at work, all of a sudden this song sprang out of some recessed molecule in my brain and flooded me with sound, lyrics and memories. Took me a while to figure out what song it was. It may not be your cup of tea, as it were, but it is nevertheless a classic song from a different, albeit not-so-distant, era. I hope you all listen to it till the end, at least once. They don't make 'em like this anymore.....

You are correct. Paul Lynde was hysterical as Uncle Arthur! As to all the rest, I know naught! In what war was that where you fought for freedoms? The great Oregon War of 1978? I think I was there....Cheap Trick opened for...gosh, can't remember much after that.... there was that dude, and the thing, and then nobody made sense....just dark and black things.... hehehehe

Murph is dead!

Sad (to me). To me, a house is not a home without pets. I married into a culture that does not keep pets AT ALL....to them, they are outside critters or food, but not something to spend money on. It did not take long to convert the spouse, however..... heck, even assisted living (old folks homes) facilitate the interaction with animals, as it enhances mood and generates smiles. I love my pets, and spoil them as much as possible, unlike the humans in my family!!

Pets can fill many voids. Have you considered?

I think one would have to affirm a benchmark, a starting point, a standard, to know from what and from where we've achieved anything. My benchmark is the era of animalistic, uncivilized, perhaps nomadic, subsistence-living, serfdom, hunting and gathering, ruled by fiefdoms and tyrants, oppression and slavery, etc..., all more primitive states of being in our historical past. Human HISTORY is rife with tyranny and misery. Today, the modern and free people have very little to do with all those primitive states of being. Why is the advancement of (many) humans away from all that not our greatest achievement? For all you spiritual people out there, isn't liberation a key and fundamental element to a happy spirit and soul? Freedom is a unique thing. Take not, it lightly.

Yessir.

panpareil, fawzo above just agreed with Hawking. repeat: what Hawking was describing was THE strongest force in the universe. Of the four fundamental forces, gravity is usually considered the weakest force in the universe but in the form of a super massive black hole, gravity is actually strong enough to not only pull light in but it can also hold whole galaxies together. While a magnet may be able to pull something away from the surface of the earth it would never stack up next to a super massive black hole. The example of a magnet as big as a black hole is ridiculous proofing. Heres a better example: take all the matter in the universe and make it into the biggest black hole ever, then take all the magnetic material in the universe and make an object next to this black hole. it would be like comparing Earth and the the Milky Way. There just isn't enough magnetism in the universe for it to be of an significant force. Gravity on the other hand is everywhere, and in everything. and forms of mass produces gravity.

I still interpret your post as saying that free-thinking and individualism, statements you were responding to, are encouraged but wrong, misguided and liberal. Perhaps your quotation marks, which I omitted here, were more significant than I gave them credit for. Heck, I have no idea what your viewpoint is. " Conventionally speaking," free-thinking is a term oft used by humanists and other liberals. Conventionally speaking, "individualism" isa term used by conservatives. Above, they were used in the same sentence, not by you, either out of ignorance or taking the terms out of normal convention. Either way, I have no idea what you think....as such, I don't want to debate. I apologize.

There are a great many links and sources that describe what you state. The most common reference is the "four fundamental forces." But what Hawking was describing was THE strongest force in the universe. Of the four fundamental forces, gravity is usually considered the weakest force in the universe but in the form of a super massive black hole, gravity is actually strong enough to not only pull light in but it can also hold whole galaxies together. While a magnet may be able to pull something away from the surface of the earth it would never stack up next to a super massive black hole. The example of a magnet as big as a black hole is ridiculous proofing. Heres a better example: take all the matter in the universe and make it into the biggest black hole ever, then take all the magnetic material in the universe and make an object next to this black hole. it would be like comparing Earth and the the Milky Way. There just isn't enough magnetism in the universe for it to be of an significant force. Gravity on the other hand is everywhere, and in everything. and forms of mass produces gravity. When super massive black holes are found to not be the strongest thing in the universe, perhaps Hawking will then be proven wrong. Thank you for your patience with me.

1. What does being a "big cat person" have to do with the topic at hand?? 2. What does God "creating all things, so all things have their place" have to do with the notion of Heaven? 3. So, animals kills to eat and live, but for many if humans do the same they are somehow "animals", yet both go to Heaven based on the same standard??? JackP, please clarify. Thank you....

Evolution isn't man's achievement. A free society, on the other hand, in antithesis to the vast majority of human history, most certainly is.... So, you equate "free thinking and individualism" as a "liberal" notion? Man, I cannot wait to debate that with you. Perhaps another time, in another thread....... Chomping at the bit.... I have found that all roads, and none at all, lead to the ULC....a defined place with little to nothing philosophically concrete in place.....other than the TOS, of course, lol.

Do you see where your debate/logical skills fall apart? You claimed a certain thing (above), and without looking anything up online or in books, I refuted it. Then you introduce a statement, which may or may not have been cited previously, as if the word of God/Fawzo has come down and decided the point. What, am I supposed to just believe, because your quoted statement includes multiple uses of the word "billions" that you are correct? THEN, you don't want repeated links that cites Hawking's assertion, as that would be....what, like refuting global warming? Really, you think we should fall through the earth if the gravitational force were the strongest in the universe?? Really? Let me know when you want to have a real discussion. Based on your feigned logic, we should all fall into ourselves based on the forces within the electron. Don't waste my time. If you want to argue Hawking, go ahead. I merely cited/quoted that man. Seems, like always, you have a hard on to "win" against my posts rather than engage in dialog. I tell you what....the next time this issue comes around in my life, I will grab a chunk and provide it to you (AGAIN)....not that it will do any good, but it will be fun for me to watch how you find fault with it.

And yet neither the comb or the paper bits falls off the face of the planet, nor defies universal gravitational forces that shape planets, galaxies and universes. After all, planets are not drawn together, clumped together like bits of paper, under some galactic comb. Case closed, really? Come on dude, seriously, stop debating me and debate instead Hawking's assertion. Or, if you like, the assertion itself.

You just lost all discernible credibility with me. The post is supposed to be about the difference between the lonely and being alone, and was posted in a specific area of the forum on purpose. Something to ponder for those who may be afflicted with something that may resonate. Whatever you are talking about, is all your own.....distractions and sidebars and off topic rants, even personal jousting, is a longstanding and acceptable nuance around here.... but whatever you are talking about, unless a deflection away from loneliness, as nothing to do with the topic at hand. Onward and Upward,

Who are you talking to? Who mentioned Elvis? What ego-prodding way are you crying about? What hand needs holding?? Seems you may be lonely. If that is the case, then I feel sorry for you. Speaking of Elvis....besides the Beatles... (Sergeant Peppers Lonely Hearts Club Band)...what 70s band spoke of "lonely hearts".....I think the band Yes did that song, right?

It isn't important that you don't. It isn't important that I don't. You may hesitate in "not necessarily disagreeing with them," but I don't. Not in the least. I take this, and most all threads on this forum, in case it was not obvious, as being serious. There is a reason for that, which the astute here could easily glean. In this thread, I'm more interested in "Mankind's Greatest Achievement".......and I will post accordingly. If others want to discuss bubble gum or lipstick, let them....but why should I ignore that fact? Am I held to a different standard? Hell, I prefer to raise the standard.... I'm not afraid. And I am very sorry if that offends the more politically correct sensibilities of the masses. No offense meant, only truth seeking. and ,

NO. Falswo has not made his case. His is the pretend world of the statist..... I could go on ad nauseum, but I choose/agreed not to.

If this post/thread does not epitomize the emotional and progressive leaning of this website/forum/"church" then I don't know what does..... My goodness people.....have you read the posts here??

Three great posts!!!

Of course. Please cite your opposition to Hawking. I am merely a conduit in this conversation...... As are you, it seems...

I recall this topic was started a few years ago. Okay, Murph, if you have not yet died of emphysema or stroke, how is the non-smoking thing workin' out for ya? How many miles per week do you run/hike/walk? How many push-ups do you do a day? Don't answer here.....just in your head and go from there.....

Do Dogs Go To Heaven? So, you've answered your own question. That is always convenient. But, what, according to your definitions, is heaven? In Judeo Christian philosophy, to go to Heaven one must acknowledge that Jesus is your Lord and Savior, the Son of God, and that He died for your sins. So how then, can dogs and mice and birds and the Chinese ever get to Heaven??? Do you assert that only pets of Christians go to Heaven, or also those herded by the Chinese? And if the latter, how so?