RevBogovac

Oh no, no, no... That was a statement (There is no soul). No reasoning with someone who takes a book (any book) literally (and himself too serious)... 😄

There is no soul. Excerpts From: Yuval Noah Harari. Homo Deus: A Brief History of Tomorrow”.

I am sorry chuchulain, I wasn't clear in my post (maybe a bit "lost in translation"). I didn't mean it like you should prove Jesus was a real person. It was more e question like: how does one prove Jesus was a real person? Because for the most part, I actually agree with you... 😊

I think you described my believes correctly, cuchulain. I also think there are a lot of "added features" by religious (and powerhungry) zealots there. But how would you prove him having been a real person...? But I am even inclined to go with Jonathan's description of "Unitarian Universalists"... I certainly do not believe Jesus rose from the dead... (that being one of those "added features"....) So definitely, as Jonathan said:

Little late? You're almost two weeks early... ! Sorry, a bit of "orthodox Christian" humor... 😂

Why do you think so chuchutrain? Until a couple of decades ago larg parts of the world did not care nor document birthdates. Do you know the birthdate of Socrat or Cleopatra? I believe there was a philosopher named Jesus about 2.000 years ago. His (direct!) followers described enough about that (in the original scrolls). It's like with Plato, he didn't document his own philosophies either, but thanks to the writings of Socrat we can all enjoy his thinking up to today. It seems Jesus' philosophies have helped build our current day lives a lot (considering equality et cetera). And he was quite adamant about them as he choose the death penalty (and an awful one at that) over taking his words back (and he was given that choice). He has my respect and gratitude (as a philospher and as a child of God, as we all are).

Funny, the whole fact you can write this on the internet using some device stems from Agnostic poeple who used Empiric methods to come to this point so you can talk about your book and spread terrorist threats ... funny...

I - personally - would say any form of genocide is bad.

And again you choose to misrepresent historic facts; yes, the books themselves might have been written before the council, but at the council it was determined which books were to be included (and which excluded) in (from) the New Testament. These choices were arbitrary and included a lot of books that were written a long time after the facts and excluded books that were actually written at the time the facts happened. The political choices that were made are clear and well documented (like - for instance - the diminishing of the significance of women, the sanctification of Jesus et cetera).

Boy, do you lack social, political and historic perspective; "promoting" and "promis[ing] everlasting life, where no pain or sorrow exist" is only possible because there is a contrast with damnation, eternal hell and all that. Classical example of power-hungry power-play... creating a non-existent problem (damnation) to offer a non-existent solution. A very old (and obviously - you being the perfect example) and quite effective strategy. If you do not know how Constantine (having selected which books to add to the bible, which to have rewritten, and which to scrap to serve his own [and his political elite's] purpose) comes into the picture... well, that actually is history (well documented, researched, and published for peer review).

You seem to forget that we come form an age where distancing oneself from "the church" was a very dangerous activity. These Atheists and Agnostics do not take that lightly, au contraire; they - on average - put in a lot of very complicated research and thought into that (quite a lot more than most "believers" most of the time...). Very often putting hteir own lives indanger (even nowadays in some part of the world) because of religious fanatics. You insult the whole group by just brushing that of as "not complicated"... but I am not surprised you do not see that.

Sure, you're absolutely right (no use arguing with you). But for the rest: a lot more activities involve piercing hands and feet and gambling is a lot older than 2.000 years... It means I find you quite a belittling person; saying there is nothing "complicated" about those groups of people. But you just keep on believing terrorist propaganda written out of context serving a bunch of power hungry individuals (read up on Constantin with regards to the bible).

Wow, just wow. You must be a genuine brain surgeon who does rocket science for a hobby...

And again you're cherrypicking.... piercing of any body parts for that matter has been done for as long as people are using "tools", no crucifixion in there whatsoever. Not to mention the splitting of "profits" and "gambling"... no prophecy whatsoever.

Yes, there is... the quotes are (by far!) not specific enough to be viewed as "fulfilled prophecies"; someone getting a death penalt for his political and/or religious believes?!? That's not a prophecy, that's a certainty (unfortunately)... I, personally, believe there actually lived a philosopher named Jesus from Nazareth some 2.000 years ago who preached a philosophy of equality and pacifism (enough "evidence" of that). What I certainly do not believe are those made-up stories that were written centuries after his death which were only meant to "sanctualize" him and serve a couple of power hungry individuals of that time. And to "drive this home" I, personally, can not take anyone very serious that nowadays still believes these (latter) stories... (except that I take it very serious when these "believers" take their believes too far and start pushing them onto other people; religion is like a penis, great to have one, OK to be proud of it, but keep it away from public and children!).

There is a distinction to be made here: there is the evidence from multiple sources on a philosopher named Jesus from a place called Nazareth who preached equality (and never said only he was the son of God) and got the death sentence for it (I would compare him to some ancient pacifistic Che Guevara, and "believe" in his existence as much as I do in - for instance - Socrat or Confusius...); and, some made up story to "sanctify" him about two centuries after his death (sentence) by a group of power-hungry individuals at the death bed of (one of) the last (Eastern) Roman emperor... these last stories (about the zombies and such) do not do the Christian philosophy (that was the basis for our current day Western society) a lot of good, nowadays...

So, first "we" (this forum) spends years right on (top of) the home page of the ULC so "we" can now get the boot? Feels strange...

Hmkay, nice new home page. Seems to have been also some kind of "merger" (or at least consolidation of some sort) with the ULC Seminary... if you go to Communities -> ULC Social Communities you'll see two lists of references; the left for ULC Online and the right for ULC Seminary... and if you scroll way down to the bottom of that page it says: "The ULC Online Forum is the original gathering place of ULC Ministers around the world. Join us at: forum.ulc.net". 1. that is not the link for this (http://ulc.net/forum) forum; and, 2. if I click the link it fails to open a page.

Indeed, both in mind as well as in prayers...

I don't know if you have followed the news a bit in the 1990's... but I am from (former) Yugoslavia. I consider myself to be (part of the social structure, that identifies itself as) Orthodox Christian. Unfortunately my family has lived in (the former Yugoslav republic of) Croatia for the previous 600 years (prior to the 1990's). Croatia is considered to be (part of the social structure, that identifies itself as) Catholic. The war that raged in the 1990's many consider to be "religious". "We" (Orthodox Christians) have been persecuted in Croatia into "extinction" (literally, the village my ancestors founded now has 2 - very old - inhabitants). But up to today I still do not consider the persecution to be religion based. It was power based. A bunch of power-hungry individuals who grasped their moment in history and used religion as an convenient opportunity...

I found the video's from Amy of the ULC Seminary that you can find on youtube quite interesting and a nice "primer" for introduction...

Hey, another doomsday prophecy! Not like "we" (mankind) haven't heard that before... Further more some of the "North American VERY TANNED previous land owners" had no problems whatsoever butchering one another (Mayan child sacrifices; and, Iroquois vs. Mohawk genocidal wars come to mind). They "just" didn't have the means (lacking a pack animal large enough to carry a human; and, the ability to make steel) to do so as effectively as "Europeans" do... Bubble burst, move on... please try to stay positive in the mean time.

Hmkay... As I already said:

Right. And: But you forgot: And than he can repent our free choices... right.

You exactly emphasise my point. Do you think we don't have culture and social pressure in the Netherlands? Believe me, we have. But we (at least a lot more of us) take the trouble of thinking a couple of steps further; remember what is important and focus on our friends and family... instead of "just" following the leader... That blackface discussion further shows the point; nobody takes that serious over here... (except for a few exceptions on both ends of the extreme). For the fast majority we like the "Aristotelian golden mean" over here... as a Dutch saying says: "act normally, and that's already strange enough". I don't know if you saw the video of our Prime Minister bumping over his cup of coffee...?