Fawzo

Lol yes Dan I figured you would respond thusly. Yes I imagine Jesus sitting right above Joshua's right shoulder rooting him on and giving him strength while Joshua rams his sword right through the heart of a terrified two year old and Jesus is thinking while the blood and guts squirts everywhere that He loves these kids and poor people we are killing so much that in 1500 years I'm going to give my life for them. You see anything obviously very not right about that picture!?!?!?!?! How dare you insult God! You mean to tell me he could not protect his chosen ones if he so desired? I'll repost my response for Coolhand for you here. Millions of these children would have loved if he would have only sat idly by! Yea he sure advocated for the children in those 30 cities where Joshua and the boys were running them through with the sword. You seem to think there is some distinction between throwing a child in a fire or running a child through with a sword or smashing his head in. I wonder if Joshua and the boys burned any of the houses when they were plundering and if any moms with their small children were in hiding and wound up getting burned to death. What of all the children in Great Flood, or the ones in Sodom and Gomorrah and the first born of Egypt. Yes thank God he appears to be on their side!!!! They even have video!!!

Yea he sure advocated for the children in those 30 cities where Joshua and the boys were running them through with the sword. You seem to think there is some distinction between throwing a child in a fire or running a child through with a sword or smashing his head in. I wonder if Joshua and the boys burned any of the houses when they were plundering and if any moms with their small children were in hiding and wound up getting burned to death. What of all the children in Great Flood, or the ones in Sodom and Gomorrah and the first born of Egypt. Yes thank God he appears to be on their side!!!!

Racism, homophobia, religious and political bigotry are all the results of intolerance. Being fearful of people who are different than you and treating them in a negative manner, Whether they think, look or act differently. The reason they do think, look or act differently is due to genetics and the area in which they were enculturenated. Fear and judgement is the basis for the problem and love and compssion is the answer. Perfect love and experiential knowledge of the Spirit of God casteth out fear from my viewpoint. That which does not cast out fear, but which engenders the judgemental mindset which fans the flames is not of God IMHO. However I will state that it may be quite possible that a person with utter and complete experiential knowledge of God who is trying to convey understanding to a group of ignorant goat herders may resort to such tactics, much in the same manner we use stories of the Bogeyman and other myths for our children. Imagine trying to teach redemptive-hermeneutics to a Pre-K class.

I think these verses are one of the reasons why the Judaic branches of Christianity such as the Ebonites and others held to the Gsopel of Matthew. What is odd though is that Jesus and his Apostles didn't exactly follow the cleanliness laws or the ones on Sabbath. Then there are also the verses which seem to state otherwise: Ephesians 2:13-15 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ. For he himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. Hebrews 7:18-19 The former regulation is set aside because it was weak and useless (for the law made nothing perfect), and a better hope is introduced, by which we draw near to God.

I'm assuming one of those condemned behaviors of which you speak is homosexuality. With the growing genetic evidence that many people are born with such sexual orientations how can one justify such condemnation. After all people are born chimeras, hermaphrodites and every other genetic combination possible. Would a just God allow children to be born condemned from birth? What I do think these births speak highly of is that God plays no hand in the process of DNA recombining and spitting out a random pair of 23 chromosome that becomes humans. He may have created the process and engines which makes it possible, but it is quite clear to me he does not get involved in the random outcomes.

I'm sure Jesus would have been right by your side with a sword in his hand helping to. And our enemies claim that the U.S. Marines eat kids, see how that works!!!! Where were the priests or prophets of God who preached to those towns about God. I don't remember hearing anything about anyone who done so. Dan I think it is beyond ludicrous to the nth degree to think that the women of Israel went out and lamented this man's daughter every year because she could not marry. Come on really!!!! How many other such days did they do so for other maidens who did not marry? In the Midrashi it is stated I do believe that he was even punished for his actions. Yes your God it seems from the way you portray him is one full of Justice and lacking any forgiveness or compassion for mankind. I'm surprised we don't hear stories of people who were killed on the spot for farting in the temple in his presence.

Can't the same now be said about the New Testament. It seems as if it has taken society as far as it can and now it is time for something fresh with a more sophisticated perspective which will assist man further along in his spiritual development. Two thousand years of the Old Testament followed by two thousand years of the New Testament followed by.......

I think the explanation is rather simple. The earth rotates and the cold air at the pole mixes with the warm air from the equator. If God can't relate that information to us no wonder there is so much debate about the concept of the Trinity. I don't buy it Dan. Can you show me any areas of the world this day where everyone is completely wicked and that there isn't any what we would consider good people. There were also unborn infants and toddlers running around that could not possibly have been deemed wicked. Even Jews like Jephthah burned his children to God. Before everyone of those acts Pete listed put the words "For God so loved the world that he......." Did God not love these people. Did not Jesus die for them as well. These gentile dogs who God loved so much" No Ammonite or Moabite shall enter the assembly of YAHWEH; even to the tenth generation none belonging to them shall enter the assembly of YAHWEH for ever ... You shall not seek their peace or their prosperity all your days for ever." (Deuteronomy Chapter 23 verse 3) "You must utterly destroy them; you shall make no covenant with them, and show no mercy to them. You shall not make marriages with them, giving your daughters to their sons or taking their daughters for your sons." (Deuteronomy Chapter 7 verse 2) "And behold, a Canaanite woman from that region came out and cried, "Have mercy on me, O Lord, Son of David; my daughter is severely possessed by a demon." But he (Christ) did not answer her a word. And his disciples came and begged him, saying, "Send her away, for she is crying after us." He answered, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel." But she came and knelt before him, saying, "Lord, help me." And he answered, "It is not fair to take the children's bread and throw it to the dogs." She said, "Yes, Lord, yet even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their masters' table."" (Matthew Chapter 15 verse 22) When one takes into account that God knew beforehand that Jesus was the propitiation for all the sins of these people he ordered murdered, it makes completely no sense to me whatsoever. I know I'm going to forgive you in the future but I am going to have to kill you now because I love you so much. I'm sorry but your unborn children and toddlers have to die as well. I just have to do it because I'm so Righteous. Pete you grab one side of this straightjacket and I'll hold the other and while Michael and Hex hold the Old Testament God well fasten it tight .

So Dan how did you decide or was told which version of that book was the corrrect one. There are a multitude of versions, it seems God was not able to keep it from wandering off course. How are you sure that the one you resonate with isn't one of the ones that have drifted off course? Where does the wind come from? In general terms, wind is created by the solar cycle through the uneven warming and cooling of the earth's surface. As the sun warms the land, air above the land is also warmed. This air rises and cooler air rushes in to replace it, producing a gentle breeze - or a howling tempest. Large-scale winds are caused by the fact that the earth's surface is heated to a greater degree at the equator than at the poles. The rotation of the earth also affects these planetary winds. On a smaller scale, winds flow through mountain valleys and spill over high peaks across unobstructed prairies.http://www.prpa.org/...wwindismade.htm Dan as you can see there are no treasuries or storhouses needed for wind. It is a quite natural event of which early bronze age man might have been quite ignorant when the Bible was written. So doesn't that prove God had nothing to do with that cosmological description of the origins of wind. You could surmise that if you are ignorant of the science behind how rainbows are formed as were the folks who wrote those portions of the Bible. I doubt if God was so ignorant and therefor played no part in authroship. Rainbows are formed when the perceiver is standing between a source of water droplets and sunlight. The light refracts off the water droplets to the perceivers eyes at varoius angles from 42 to 45 degrees creating the different hues. Rain is not needed. Rainbows are created by waterfalls, the moon and would have been most assuredly created by that imaginary mist the Fundalmentalists claims covered the earth before it was suppose to have rained. Once again it seems quite evident it is a stroy of sheer ignorarnce of science and the natural world and myth of bronze age man. No hand of God here unless God is as ignorant. Dan I surely hope and pray that some portion of you cringed or doubted in your heart those words you typed that I bolded from your response. That portion that would be cringing or hesitating is the real written Word of God which is written within yours and everyones heart. If no portion of you cringed or gave pause when you wrote that, then I feel you have been endoctrinated to the point of a jihadist who is capable of starpping a bomb to them self and killing others with no remorse. What do you think is more plausible Dan? That some Bronze Age desert dwellers saw a pillar of salt in a region where they were common that looked like a sexy female and told a story to their kids about how it was made as is human nature or that God actually turned a woman into a pillar of salt against her will. Sodom and Gomorrah may have very well been destroyed by some cataclysmic event such as the same thing which happened in Tunguska which science still isn't 100% sure about its origins. If a similar event happened back during the Bronze Age what kind of myths would have been created to explain the source. Wouldn't the gods have been credited with its origin, so once this seems like the ignorance of man to me. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunguska_event I know you like to claim that God protected the version of the written word that you cherish, but you must also realize that this written word were stories handed down by campfires for ages before they were even written down. Did God protect the embellishment of campfire stories as well? Dan you as a modern Christian hold a complete Bible in your hand so that you can cross reference information to make apologetics for clear discrepancies. The person who wrote the Gospel of John did not hold or have knowledge of the Book of Revelations and the person for whom the message was originally intended did not have knowledge or access either, as it was written later. A lot of these crazy bizarre apolegetics that Christians make up need to take this into consideration. If I am writing this post for your benefit, I hopefully am entering all the information you need and that I wish to convey to you. I'm not trying to write stuff with hidden meanings for future generations that my brothers Michael, Pete and Hex can finish up on later and complete.

I'll have to try a Quaker service, it sounds interesting. I think a big problem for this concept of Trinity and the Divinity of Yeshua is that the four Gospel writers and Paul aren't delivering to us the same personality. Just compare the suffering human like Jesus in the Gospel of Mark who is capable of being tempted, prays for the cup to pass him by and cries out in agony and abandonment in his final moments, with the super human and Divine Jesus who is beyond being tempted always in control, and scoffs at asking the cup to pass him by. he even is in control up to the final moments on the cross when instead of crying out in agony and abandonment he simply states "it is finished" The Four Gospels do not paint for us one homogenous Jesus. There is the more human Jesus in Mark, the teaching Rabbi like preacher in Matthew, the mediator in Luke and the super hero ultra Divine man in John. I think the Jesus in the Gospel of Mark would barely recognize the Man in the Gospel of John.

Dan I do not doubt God's ability to preserve His Word. He need not write it down as it is written in the heart and mind of every sentient being. What I do doubt is your abilty to objectively decide which one of the tens of thousands of alleged written words of God and their variants that exist on our planet are closest to the one written in the mind of Christ Consciousness. Lets face it the odds are at least 1 in 100,000 that you have selected correctly and the odd thing is everyone is making the same bet with their life. Why is your wager a better bet? Did God really mean there are storehouses in the sky for the wind. Is the firmamnet a hardened shell with windows for the rain to come through, Did God really mean that it is ok to kill adulterers, disobedient children, people who work the Sabbath. Is it ok to sell your daughter off or to beat a slave to death as long as he lives for two days because he is your property. Is it ok to kill 30 cities full of people because you and your family need a place to stay. Was the earth created in 6 days. Are bats birds and man only exist here for 6 thousand years. Are women turned to salt and men live inside fish under the sea for 3 days. Didn't rainbows exist before there was an alleged Great Global flood. Sounds like a lot of superstitious nonsense to a lot of people and yet you and a lot of other people are betting all your chips on it.

Nice post Pete! Yep I think if a writing comes from the Spirit of God, then it should be only about love and compassion for God and our fellow man. Maybe we should judge whether all scripture is of God or man by that criteria. If a scripture instills love and compassion within our hearts than it meets the Golden Standard for being God Inspired. If It instills judgment, condemnation and fear than we can be sure it must come from the egoic projections of anthropomorphism of man. We only need two or three to agree on this for it to be so, can I get an AMEN?

If I find time later this evening Brother I'll dig out my copy of Misquoting Jesus and find a few that Bart D. Erhman mention in his book "Misquoting Jesus" Another major problem is in the original translations from Hebrew and Aramaic into Greek them self as I am sure you are aware of in your studies and as our beloved RabbiO has shown on quite a few occasions.

I'll give you the short version from above:

Thanks Hooka! All is impermanence and change. Today I make Halloween Pumpkins with my Godchild and all will be well!

Thanks folks!!! My extended family here really has made a difference.

Thank you friend!

Thanks Dan! Yes that is one memory my Step-Mom did not deserve. The last few months have made me reconsider the idea of assisting those who wish to suffer no more and leave this plane of existence. Should we really be forcing all those folks like my grandmother who prayed every day for seven months that her Christian God would come and save her from her suffering.

Coolhand isn't that exactly what the Bible claims? Whose fault was it that I was born with a sinful nature and into a world of sin......surely not mine as an infant I thought poo was a plaything! Who saved me from my sins......surely not me! Exactly what the Bible teaches if you ask me. Who did create the genetic code which was born into the world and became Coolhand. Why do so many of these such codes fail or are defective?

Thanks Dave! I think my Buddhist studies and personal metaphysical experiences with what I believe to be the other side, makes these events less traumatic for me. I fully comprehend the Buddhist teachings of the impermanence of all things and that it is our clinging to things that causes much of our pain. I think of the thousands of children who died horrible deaths because of malnourishemnet from the time my Dad passed and yet I shed not one tear for any of them and that my dad had a full life and caused much of his own suffering and pain from a life of alcohlism and heavy smoking. Yes I still mourn and am saddened and will miss him, but I realize that self pity does me little good. My experiences with what I believe to be the otther side leave me to believe it is nothing short of fantabulous and that my dad is way better off now. I hope he gets the chance to learn from mistakes he made during his last focus and gets a chance to make things right for himself. One of my personal short falls in this life is that I've always been overtly cerebral compared to emotional. I think I've missed out on many wonderful experiences in my own focus in this life by over thinking things. The recent passing of my family members has given me a chance to reflect on this. I thank you all for your well wishes. They truly helped me make it through the day by kindling a warm spot in my heart with each response posted.

Thanks for the hugs and prayers! Much appreciated today. Thank you friend your kind words have helped bring that piece to my heart! Thank You!

Thanks RevRainbow and Thumper. I guess I'm just kind of numb. I just lost my grandmother 10 days ago and still am not totally over that. I actually went to work today to keep myself busy but I'm not very focused. Thanks again friends!!!!!

Thanks my friend!!!! I wish he could have found another way to leave this plane of physicality and end his suffering. I wouldn't want anyone to hang around and suffer just to please my selfish whims though. He lived in Florida and while we weren't the closest Father and Son combination, we did keep in touch. I was the only one of his children who ever forgave him and would speak with him. Hopefully he finds some rest now from the demons that haunted him his whole life. Thanks again my friend!!!!!

My Dad came home from the nursing home yesterday and I guess tired of suffering and feeling useless he grabbed a gun and took his own life. He was in his mid 70's. Any positive thoughts and well wishes that can be sent his way will be greatly appreciated! Brightest Blessings!!!

I think I would worry more about the television programming and the video games many children watch endlessly instead of a yearly date on the Gregorian Calendar where they get to to have some ghoulish fun. Maybe from a psychological viewpoint allowing kids to act out some of their darker side once a year is better for them. Even as an adult practicing Pentecostal in an Assembly God church I felt the substitute type celebrations were rather lame. The idea that this "veil" gets thinner on this one specific Gregorian calendar day seems rather suprstitious to me as well.