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Zequatanil

Tolerance/acceptance?

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As I was reading all the posts regarding Scott`s question about gay marriage being "allowed" a few things occurred to me. The word "allow" already puts it in a different light--it should not even enter the picture--in the personal way. The law of the land is different--that is for the politicians and the majority to sort out.

What does "do only that which is right" mean. Is it for ones-self or the planet?-- for one may not be in line with the other--yet one may still be morally and ethically doing what is right for their heart. As Br Devon so succinctly put it--

As long as humankind exists there will be those who will support an action, those who will tolerate an action and those who will oppose an action. And as long as humankind exists, there will be matters for which all three groups will be "right." Just because something is agreeable to one or disagreeable to one does not make it right or wrong for all.

So--then is it not "tolerance/acceptance" that is the most important ingredients of living in harmony. By acceptance, I don`t mean amalgamation. One can be accepting and yet be separate/ with own ideas, beliefs--No? Are we doing that in this forum? In know there are very few who can with an open heart say that--including myself at times. We say we are tolerant/accepting--but are we?

Beliefs as love cannot be forced by holding a gun to the head, neither can they be changed, but often there are many answers to one question--and many right ways. As long as there is no pain inflicted, one can follow their own path--that is absolutely the right way.

blessings, more love, compassion and tolerance,

Suzanne

Edited by Quetzal

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Here is the way I view it.

I tolerate that Westboro Baptist has their views on various topics because they have a right to those view, regardless of if I agree with them or not....I do not accept their actions that infringe on other's rights to believe and be different from Westboro's ideals.

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Beliefs as love cannot be forced by holding a gun to the head, neither can they be changed, but often there are many answers to one question--and many right ways. As long as there is no pain inflicted, one can follow their own path--that is absolutely the right way.

..."Neither can they [beliefs] be changed...." I will disagree here. I, myself, have changed my beliefs several times throughout my life coming into new knowledge and better understanding, as I see it.

These forums and discussions are venues in which multiple belief systems and interpretations can bring us new perspectives on beliefs we may consider closed to argument. In this discussion and sharing process, we may see a new perspective that blows us away and challenges us to revisit our interpretation. This process of progressing belief systems can be seen as enlightenment - when we open ourselves to accept everything as a facet of The One, both "negative" and "positive." We cannot separate ourselves from the polarization of the material world until we depart from it.

I have progressed from a reactionary Roman Catholic seminarian, to an agnostic, to an atheist. I am a Freemason who does not believe in "God," but in a Divine Force. And today, I am a believer in the Divinity in each and every one and thing. To complicate things further, I now believe that present day religions worship beings, "gods," from other planets. I also believe in the survival of the spirit, and have just recently come to a belief in reincarnation. Also, I once believed in apocalyptic prophecies. I now believe these prophecies are a control mechanism of these religions.

An inability to alter our belief system constitutes a closed mind.

Edited by LifeLoveUnity

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An inability to alter our belief system constitutes a closed mind.

Or perhaps, the ability to maintain a specific belief constitutes a satisfied mind :)

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..."Neither can they [beliefs] be changed...." I will disagree here.

I agree absolutely with you----but `not by holding a gun to a head`, by force but by coming to realization from within.

An inability to alter our belief system constitutes a closed mind.

Yes :derisive:

To complicate things further, I now believe that present day religions worship beings, "gods," from other planets. I also believe in the survival of the spirit, and have just recently come to a belief in reincarnation. Also, I once believed in apocalyptic prophecies. I now believe these prophecies are a control mechanism of these religions.

Yes I believe this also!--but this is what I call evolving, or becoming more enlightened. By beliefs as such is simply having a little more complex interpretation on some simple facts that man has believed over the ages. But the underlying basic facts seem to be the same . Be that a God in heaven or gods from an other galaxy--though in most organized religion these new ideas are mostly considered heretical. As a theist--for me all things are possible with God--thus for me it never shakes my faith if physics/science comes up with the strangest of discoveries.

http://www.foxnews.com/science/2013/01/08/at-least-17-billion-earth-size-planets-are-in-milky-way-new-estimate-says/

"At least 17 billion Earth-size planets are in Milky Way, new estimate says."

blessings and peace,

Suzanne

Edited by Quetzal

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As I was reading all the posts regarding Scott`s question about gay marriage being "allowed" a few things occurred to me. The word "allow" already puts it in a different light--it should not even enter the picture--in the personal way. The law of the land is different--that is for the politicians and the majority to sort out.

What does "do only that which is right" mean. Is it for ones-self or the planet?-- for one may not be in line with the other--yet one may still be morally and ethically doing what is right for their heart. As Br Devon so succinctly put it--

As long as humankind exists there will be those who will support an action, those who will tolerate an action and those who will oppose an action. And as long as humankind exists, there will be matters for which all three groups will be "right." Just because something is agreeable to one or disagreeable to one does not make it right or wrong for all.

So--then is it not "tolerance/acceptance" that is the most important ingredients of living in harmony. By acceptance, I don`t mean amalgamation. One can be accepting and yet be separate/ with own ideas, beliefs--No? Are we doing that in this forum? In know there are very few who can with an open heart say that--including myself at times. We say we are tolerant/accepting--but are we?

Beliefs as love cannot be forced by holding a gun to the head, neither can they be changed, but often there are many answers to one question--and many right ways. As long as there is no pain inflicted, one can follow their own path--that is absolutely the right way.

blessings, more love, compassion and tolerance,

Suzanne

I think this is more complicated than it needs to be. I am "respectful" of difference. :)

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Or perhaps, the ability to maintain a specific belief constitutes a satisfied mind :)

Sometimes, yes. And sometimes........no.

Sometimes it takes a change or multiple changes in order to get to the one belief that works for you, in which case, your steadfast adherence would indicate a satisfied mind. However, if you grew up in one belief, believing that all others are wrong because that's what you were taught, then your ability to maintain a specific belief would indicate a closed mind, bordering on brainwashing. Of course, if you grew up with one belief, have looked at others, and still maintain your beliefs while being accepting of others'; that would indicated an open and satisfied mind.

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..."Neither can they [beliefs] be changed...." I will disagree here. I, myself, have changed my beliefs several times throughout my life coming into new knowledge and better understanding, as I see it. .....I have progressed from a reactionary Roman Catholic seminarian, to an agnostic, to an atheist. ....I am a believer in the Divinity in each and every one and thing. To complicate things further, I now believe that present day religions worship beings, "gods," from other planets. I also believe in the survival of the spirit, and have just recently come to a belief in reincarnation. Also, I once believed in apocalyptic prophecies. I now believe these prophecies are a control mechanism of these religions. An inability to alter our belief system constitutes a closed mind.

(Emphasis added)

Or perhaps, the ability to maintain a specific belief constitutes a satisfied mind :)

(Emphasis added)

Sometimes it takes a change or multiple changes in order to get to the one belief that works for you, in which case, your steadfast adherence would indicate a satisfied mind. However, if you grew up in one belief, believing that all others are wrong because that's what you were taught, then your ability to maintain a specific belief would indicate a closed mind, bordering on brainwashing. Of course, if you grew up with one belief, have looked at others, and still maintain your beliefs while being accepting of others'; that would indicated an open and satisfied mind.

(Emphasis added)

IMHO, the basic context of these statements point out a very important, rudimentary human behavior. Those who believe something to please others, and those who believe something because it makes rational sense to their Higher Self. I am not making a comparative as to any of you 3 personally, just your statements. Thank you for understanding the difference.

In some ways I envy someone who has been able to maintain one Belief System their entire life, in many other ways, it really scares me. I say that as I've only met a very few who have resolved all issues and contradictions to their Beliefs through a litmus test of truly understanding all other Beliefs, and have been able to allow others the same freedom. At a very young age I recognized blind faith as being destructive to Self, and no I'm not talking about Eric, Steve, Ric and Ginger's one album hit.

I'm talking about those who satisfied others 'because that's how they were raised' and those who had firm Beliefs in a truth. There's absolutely nothing wrong about tradition, family ways and such, however when those beliefs verge on hypocrisy and denying ones Self truth in the process, there is something wrong there. It's difficult to even discuss this issue without giving the appearance of "dissing" someone else's Beliefs, so I'll try to be as sensitive as I can.

Even some of the Pagan texts and manuscripts I've read, in regard to my own Beliefs, have a "warning" in the foreword reminding the reader not to believe anything but what is written therein and/or to trust the author because s/he had a vision or inspired insight.

But how can I just ignore the
provable history
that contradicts what the author(s) wrote?

How can I cling to the
mysticism
that bona fide
science
has deemed irrelevant?

Why should I have unbending faith in something that overwhelming evidence shows is, at minimum,
different
in the chain of events or biography of the characters?

These, and many other questions/scenarios are exactly why I choose to follow my path. I am allowed to glean the meaning and thrust of the writing while also being allowed to apply facts and new knowledge since the manuscript was written to my understanding. I am not bound to the ridiculous notion of "because I said so, and my daddy said so and his daddy said so and his daddy said so and"....you get the picture. No matter how well intentioned or progressively thought out and rationalized, every Scared text on the planet was written by the hand of man. The Gita's, Koran, Bible, Book of Toth, Edda, etc etc. Regardless of how inspired or moved the author was by his Spiritual Self or omniscient deity, s/he wrote it down.

Along the timeline of history and the many copies set forth before the age of the printing press, each one may have but a few words changed, a meaning edited or an idea truncated for space, I have to question if it still maintains the integrity of the original. Worse was the period some 5,000 years ago when our oral history was first being put to clay tablet. And worse yet, somewhere along this timeline authorities, that were not the author(s), got together and decided which myth, personal account or historical fact was to be included in future copies.

Giving all this an acceptable amount of regard, do any of us believe what our Faith dictates or do we have faith in what our Beliefs dictate? Does the satisfaction of our Higher Self account for anything, or do we also ignore that in lieu of what we are told to believe?

My Belief is a never ending, evolving thing....that is one of the very few things I have total Faith in.

Blessings of Peace,

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