Atwater Vitki

Very interesting Salem, the same "vision of Self" my wife has had since childhood of me. In her vision, she is being taken or forced away from me, hands reaching for each other and we both are saying "I will find you!". Several time during the first year or so we knew each other she tried to approach the subject, but just couldn't, not yet. It wasn't until I joined her on Maui she finally let on why she had been so curious about "where we had met" before we physically met in 1980. The 'spooky' part, the instant she told me, the blank face on a woman I had "seen" in vision since my childhood came into focus and of course, it was her!Chilling when things like that come together. (Gulp!) Even though I know there is evidence of this practice (from Egytian palace hieroglyphs and papyrus) I seem to recall an article where this may be where the Romans got the idea of feeding captives to lions etc. in the coliseums. It is also known that perhaps as much as 80% of the Roman army was made up of captured armies and local "volunteers" as they conquered new territories. Guess what I'm getting at is from historical evidence, very possible to have a "Red Beard" mixed in the ranks, as even Egyptians took captives and slaves from their conquests...poor guy! About a year and a half ago(ish) I was corresponding with a previous Member regarding OBE and Astral Projection as I had finally reached that level of experience in my meditations. Awesome experience...except... as you say here about "squatters"...interesting term that fits perfectly. Yes, very unsettling and extremely negative. This was definitely the time when I discovered how essential and important it is to fully ground one's self prior to AT...to have a firm grasp on the 'silver cord' as it were! This seems to be a rather common vision to what are termed "Indigo", "Starseed" or "Starchild" amongst some groups. There's a lot of speculation in the science world as to how a binary star could support an inhabited planet, but ya know, I think this Universe knows what it's doing and anything is possible. Just because puny man can't seem to figure it out doesn't even run through my filter! I'll see if I can find the article I read on the Pleiades galaxy having more binary star systems than what is "common", even though binary stars are found everywhere in the universe...not as uncommon as once thought. There are a good number of writers and speakers on the subject of "Indigo", "Star Seed" or "Star Child" that all seem to concur that the Pleiades being "home" to a long ago civilization that moved to Earth, whether out of need or simple exploration curiosity seems to be the question. Mithrandir/King, Do either of you identify with any of these groups or feel you may have some of the traits, qualities or attributes of such? As for my own "visions" of the past/previous lives, since around 10ish years old I've had 3 settings that seem to haunt my memory. One is Stone Age: It's like I'm standing behind someone (Self??) sitting at the opening to a large cave, looking out across a vast Serengeti type landscape. The smell of crisp air, fire smoke and something like baaad BO/rotting meat permeates the scene. It must be mid-day as no sun is seen, but it's dark inside and very light outside...just that little glimpse is all there is, but so visceral, so "more than" real. Even now thinking about it it's difficult to separate that (or any of the 3 visions) from what I know are real experiences from my life. The second: is at the Battle of Cathars...and me thinks I'm on the losing end...I am robed, holding a large leather bound book, other close to me in dark robes and also having either these huge books or gands (wands) or things like talismans, incense, feathers etc. We are most definitely doing a majikal Working of some sort. Ahead of us is some loud, screaming (think of Wallace in Braveheart working up the troops) "Captain" of the forces riding back and forth on his coal black horse rallying our army. The "magicians" keep yelling at him to be quiet, shut-up as quiet would be an ally at this time, not giving away our position, but never the less he keeps riding back and forth screaming into the heavens and at the troops. The scene takes a quick shift to the clamor of battle and then I feel the cold steel of either spear or possibly sword, pierce my back and run me through...fade to black. One of the stranger things of this one, the "Captain" on the horse I sense to be either 'brother' or close enough friend to be like a brother. 20+ years ago my real brother and I exchanged blind letters, written without knowledge of the other's content (only that we'd write down our "visions") mailed on same day. He was in Seattle, I was in Humboldt. In his letter he tells of being the a "leader of forces, on a black horse, rallying troops at Bèziers", I related the above. (Bèziers was one of the final massacres of the Cathars in 1209) This was when we both got very serious into our exploration of the "Old Ways". The third: is 19th century farmland, Europe, rolling hills, small cabin-like house in distance (don't see, but sense) a mule and plow behind me. Female, which I presume is the wife, (This was the "blank face" mentioned above) calling to me from the yard in front of cabin...long, simple dress, hair up and in a sort of cap with strings hanging down...one hand shades her eyes the other waving. I can't hear what she's saying but know I need to get over there quickly. This one was also just that glimpse, but the smell of fresh turned earth, sweaty animal, stove smoke in the air and I can feel myself standing there and starting to walk. Very visceral. These are all very interesting experiences that everyone has been kind enough to share. Kind of difficult to do, even amongst people who sort of know each other and have similar interests. But yes, I must added to Suzanne's sincere gratitude for everyone sharing what is a bit of "hokey-pokey mumbo-jumbo" to some folks.....well joke 'em all if they can't take a... !!...we all know what is real to us and it doesn't have to make sense to the nay sayer and people with less than open minds now does it? This is a marvelous and wonderful Universe and nothing, I mean nothing, should be out of the scope of possibility and more-so probability? Blessings of Peace,

You're right Bro. Kaman, no successful suicide has ever been prosecuted...at least that which a brief search found....but many unsuccessful ones have been. As for the poll, everyone has their own view of being a responsible person. While I personally think a pregnant Mom to be should respect the life she's bringing into this world, that does not mean there should be laws forcing her to do so. (Which by the way those laws are forthcoming "soon to a State near you" if the Feds get their way) Unfortunately this will all be done under the guise of public policy and what's "best" for us, but alas, just another restriction on our everyday lives. "Do only that which is Right" certainly applies here, but then everyone defines that just a tad different for themselves it seems. "Do what thou wilst as long as no harm becomes another" also applies, but then people play the odds on things that have various possible or multiple choice outcomes. Bottom line, for any one standard to apply, everyone needs to have the same set of moral and ethical standards, which we know is a giant rabbit black hole of personal opinion. Blessings of Peace,

Nothing I've read requires anyone but the pastor to be in such a licensed position. Usually the Secretary and Treasurer are merely members of said congregation, but even that is not required, just usual practice, unless you are going to Incorporate. You will also need to formulate such things as your Mission Statement, Charter/Creed/Doctrine etc and if you are going to be "Non-Profit" what IRS requires for legit 501 © 3. There's not a whole lot of painful paperwork involved, most counties require a few simple forms. Perhaps someone who has been through this process, not just read about it, can help. I have an overtly simple, personal registration for my "congregation" and was just hoping to answer your initial question...and um yeah...what Bro Kaman said about legal advice, not here either! Blessings of Peace,

Very nice Quetzal...I wasn't that familiar with Rumi's work until this...knew the name but not any specific work....but this one goes into the c/p file of poetry. I love the closing line... "This is your own voice echoing off the walls of God." Most excellent! Thanks for sharing, Al

Welcome rpavellas (until we know what you prefer ) and I must say an interesting history on your site noted in signature. Stockholm? Really? My favorite aunt and uncle live in Kvicksund, not too far from Esliklstuna where my grandparents were from. I stayed there, and Uppsala, for 10 months while taking studies at Uppsala Universitet (and on Birka) in 2000 as part of my Fellowship Program. It was such an overwhelming experience to walk the same roads and streets as my ancient ancestors once did. In the past, several of my relatives told similar stories to what I'm sure you heard from your grandparents about living during the Great Depression and shows, regardless of from where, the hearty nature of our fore bearers making a new life for themselves and the generations to follow. I think we owe them all an honorable place in our memories. I hope you quickly find yourself to home here and we look forward to hearing more from you. Blessings of Peace,

...and the true Sages step in! I asked Kay to read this topic, and the ensuing posts, and then we discussed this issue. One of the biggest, no, the HUGEST, thing for Kay and I to overcome in life has come since the accident that took so much from us. Active, busy, hardworking, outgoing, involved lives that came to a screeching halt. To us, there was nothing short of a 50-60 hour work week, play hard weekends and an additional many hours per week involved in our community. Since our daily "routine" of being on the go and every day being an adventure was ended for us, we forget...due to our emotions and fears... just how much we had already done in this Life and maybe being on the kaputz now isn't so bad or as "worthless" as it feels sometimes. We enjoyed being productive in our personal endeavors and involved in our community and now we physically "can't" any more. Oh we do the best we can with what we have and 'dabble' in things, but it seems so trivial compared to days of the past. We can certainly identify with Quetzal in the opening post, and all the responses, but then the little reminders from Crzyme and Jonathan sure hit home in summary. Thank you! Everyone's contribution here has helped a couple of bizzy bee's, turned old dogs (way before their time from our perspective) see things just a bit different. Appreciate it! I hope Suzanne got as much from it as we did and look forward to hearing more! Blessings of Peace,