Salvation for Fallen Humans & Fallen Angels (A Practical Guide)

[cuchulain]

I think you have no evidence about spirit to compare either... how do you compare a person's spirit before and after a labotomy when you can't identify it in the first place.

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

1 hour ago, cuchulain said:

I think you have no evidence about spirit to compare either... how do you compare a person's spirit before and after a labotomy when you can't identify it in the first place.

 

 

What do we actually know about "spirit"?  We have plenty of Scripture.  We have plenty of faith statements and empty assertions.  But what do we actually know about "Spirit"?  Nothing.  We have no hard facts.  We have plenty of pretend facts based on nothing.  Nothing at all.  It all boils down to faith and assertion.  It isn't even bad evidence.  It's no evidence at all.  Which makes the assertions meaningless and irrelevant. 

 

Anything which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed, without evidence.

 

 

 

 

[cuchulain]

I was aiming at the conclusion that spirit as defined by christians, unaltered and immortal, simply doesnt exist.  Psychology has studied labotomies thoroughly.  They alter the entire persona, everything survivors have said points to an alteration at their basic level, or what christians continually define as the soul.  I thought erroneously that being subjected to basic facts would shine a light on this myth of a soul.  What can i say? I been working a lot of hours and wasnt thinking about the automatic bs factory that kicks in when opposing true facts collide with the bible.  My bad 😁

[Dan56]

19 hours ago, Jonathan H. B. Lobl said:

What do we actually know about "spirit"?  We have plenty of Scripture.

 

There ya go.... that's where you learn it, because it ain't in no science books.

 

1 hour ago, cuchulain said:

I was aiming at the conclusion that spirit as defined by christians, unaltered and immortal, simply doesnt exist.  Psychology has studied labotomies thoroughly.  They alter the entire persona, everything survivors have said points to an alteration at their basic level, or what christians continually define as the soul.  I thought erroneously that being subjected to basic facts would shine a light on this myth of a soul.  What can i say? I been working a lot of hours and wasnt thinking about the automatic bs factory that kicks in when opposing true facts collide with the bible.  My bad 😁

 

Its difficult to explain to a layman, but your spirit has nothing to do with your brain, no more than your heart has anything to do with your emotions.  Distinguishing between spirit, soul, mind, brain, and heart, even confuses me. I may have described 'spirit' wrong, but it is simply a consciousness that never dies, it is given by God and goes back to God. This site best describes it, along with explaining the difference between soul and spirit.  https://www.getbibleanswers.org/spirit-soul-heart-mind.html

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

2 hours ago, cuchulain said:

I was aiming at the conclusion that spirit as defined by christians, unaltered and immortal, simply doesnt exist.  Psychology has studied labotomies thoroughly.  They alter the entire persona, everything survivors have said points to an alteration at their basic level, or what christians continually define as the soul.  I thought erroneously that being subjected to basic facts would shine a light on this myth of a soul.  What can i say? I been working a lot of hours and wasnt thinking about the automatic bs factory that kicks in when opposing true facts collide with the bible.  My bad 😁

 

 

So far as I'm concerned, talking about "spirit" or "soul" is exactly like talking about God.  We have no objective, verifiable facts.  No hard evidence.  Not even soft evidence.  Nothing at all.

 

"Spirit" could exist.  There's no good reason to believe that this is the case -- so it doesn't actually matter.

 

When objective, verifiable facts become available --then -- it will matter.  In the meantime, it is a waste of time and effort to argue meaningless metaphysics, with those who care only about "faith" -- which is just another word for "opinion".  

 

 

 

 

 

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

1 hour ago, Dan56 said:

 

There ya go.... that's where you learn it, because it ain't in no science books.

 

 

Its difficult to explain to a layman, but your spirit has nothing to do with your brain, no more than your heart has anything to do with your emotions.  Distinguishing between spirit, soul, mind, brain, and heart, even confuses me. I may have described 'spirit' wrong, but it is simply a consciousness that never dies, it is given by God and goes back to God. This site best describes it, along with explaining the difference between soul and spirit.  https://www.getbibleanswers.org/spirit-soul-heart-mind.html

 

 

because it ain't in no science books.

That's true.  There is no reliable information about "spirit" or "soul" in science books.  We can agree on this.

 

no more than your heart has anything to do with your emotions.

Spoken like a man who disdains science.  Emotions have significant influence on the heart.

 

Distinguishing between spirit, soul, mind, brain, and heart, even confuses me.

Allow me to assist with your confusion.  Mind, brain and heart all exist. 

 

Spirit and Soul are religion.  I take no position on this matter.  Consider me "Agnostic".  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dan56]

8 hours ago, Jonathan H. B. Lobl said:

 

no more than your heart has anything to do with your emotions.

 

Spoken like a man who disdains science.  Emotions have significant influence on the heart.

 

Distinguishing between spirit, soul, mind, brain, and heart, even confuses me.

Allow me to assist with your confusion.  Mind, brain and heart all exist. 

 

Spirit and Soul are religion.  I take no position on this matter.  Consider me "Agnostic". 

 

Feelings & love don't literally emanate from the heart, that's just an expression. The heart pumps blood, it doesn't feel emotions. You may be confusing Valentines Day with medical science

 

Of course the mind, brain and heart exist.. But allow me to assist you, they aren't all the same thing.

 

A man’s soul is the means by which he has self-consciousness, and even nonreligious people seem to have that awareness, although I'm beginning to wonder 

Edited April 15, 2019 by Dan56

[Jonathan H. B. Lobl]

8 hours ago, Dan56 said:

 

Feelings & love don't literally emanate from the heart, that's just an expression. The heart pumps blood, it doesn't feel emotions. You may be confusing Valentines Day with medical science

 

Of course the mind, brain and heart exist.. But allow me to assist you, they aren't all the same thing.

 

A man’s soul is the means by which he has self-consciousness, and even nonreligious people seem to have that awareness, although I'm beginning to wonder 

 

 

The heart does not, as you say, "emanate love".  Negative emotions, rage and resentment, will have a destructive influence on the heart.  Also digestion, elimination and the muscles.  The mind influences the body and the body influences the mind.

 

When you establish that the soul exists, we can go on to discuss what it does.

 

Your understanding of nonreligious people, leaves much to be desired.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 15, 2019 by Jonathan H. B. Lobl