Bro. Hex

Nice verbage. Always useful when one wants to "change the subject" Now, let ME remind YOU. You didn't answer the question. (BTW I don't have any trouble remembering what I said... and what I DIDN'T say; Like: "there is no overcoming evil")

Apparently the truth did not give YOU hope, as I offered you the truth, which (apparently) you did not like, as you replied: "What hope am I supposed to gain from that?" (Am I the one who is supposed to show you how to find hope in the face of truth?) Do you want me to hold your hand and tell you fairy tales? I offered you truth, and you asked me for hope. Which one of us has a problem seeing hope? Which one of us has created a dichotomy?

Do you want hope, or do you want truth? Actually neither one "can be handed to you". You have to make hope. you have to discover truth. If neither of those options appeal to you, you are not ready for the journey.

What would make it "go away"? WE are still here, so evil is still here. and goodness is still here. When man is gone evil will cease. Evil is a necessary possibility so long as there is free will. Because we ARE NOT good, well-intentioned human beings. We prefer to think we are "good people"...but we are both good and bad...inside. Absolutely! We ARE flawed. We are what we are.

Okay, you have now answered MY questions. If I understand you correctly, you have answered thusly: 6,000,000 Jews died in the Holocaust "because they didn't pray to Jesus" From my POV, you have just described an utterly despicable God; a God thoroughly unworthy of either love or respect. I'd sooner have a Golden Calf. Now I will answer your question: You said: "It appears to me that only Jesus has given us the authority to carry out this battle, and only through His name are we supposed to do battle. Am I correct? " No, you are not correct. And the error is multifaceted: (1) You do not need any external authority to strive against evil in this world. (I assume that striving against evil is what you mean by "doing battle". I find the "military rendering" a bit over-the-top and distorting of reality, but I think I get your general gist). (2)If you were in need of external "Authority" (which you aren't) Jesus could not provide it. God could, but Jesus could not. (3)"Doing battle" in the name of God is what the Crusades were all about. Killing people in the name of God. Is was an evil undertaking of plunder and territorial expansion, and it was dressed up in holiness...which made it all the more evil. (4)In the frame of reference that you suggest, "we" (the human race) is "at war" with an invisible army of Evil Beings. This is nonsense. It borders on delusional. And yes, I know that lots of people believe it to be true. That doesn't make it so. There certainly IS evil in this world. Evil deeds are performed every day...by people just like us. It may make people feel better to believe that Evil is "out there", a being separate from ourselves. But evil lies "within us"...just like goodness. Good and evil are alive and well in our individual psyches. In some of us one or the other tends to dominate. But most of the time we are all a mixture of both. WE are the Bogeyman. WE are "the devil". And we are the agents of Goodness in this world. That is how God works...through us. It may make you "feel good" to talk disparagingly about Liberal Christianity. But I really think it only works to demonstrate otherwise. One more thing: There IS no "lake of fire".

I will answer your question after you answer three of mine that I have already asked you: (1) That's what 6,000,000 Jews were supposed to do..."Pray in Jesus' name"??? (2) Are you SERIOUS??? (3) And they died "because they didn't"???

. Really? That's what 6,000,000 Jews were supposed to do? "Pray in Jesus' name"??? Are you SERIOUS??? And they died "because they didn't"??? That can't be right. Oh, and I think that they "passed the fasting test", what with being "slowly starved to death".

. The Peanut Brittle, Definitely the PEANUT BRITTLE.... Yummmmmmmmm!

. I didn't say that. But I really could not care less whether they were historical figures, or whether they are only mythical. Factuality is not the important aspect. It is the story that really matters. If and when any of it matters. I say "only mythical", because whether or not they were historic, they most certainly are mythical characters. It is of course possible (and a not infrequent thing) for someone "to be both". Napoleon was both. Mohammad was both. Jesus was both. Caesar was both Alexander the Great was both. Mythical does not mean "false" It means "Larger than life". Which is another matter entirely.

I am sure that this is true of many, many people. Perhaps it is even true of most people. It is not, however, true of everyone. There are those among us who crave the sort of "certainty" that belief in an inerrant Bible seems to offer. There are others among us who cannot accept easy answers, who cannot accept answers "provided by others", who by their very nature, have to decide for themselves. One kind of person is not necessarily better, or worse, than the other. We were not all made the same. Each of us must find his own path. My path may not suit you, as yours does not suit me. I have to say, I think that is "a good thing". In a word, "No." The Bible is a compendium of a whole lot of different "books" written by a whole lot of different "authors" over a whole lot of different "epochs", in different "cultures", in which the very words used may have different meanings, from one book to another. Some of the stories are borrowed from civilizations and peoples from ages past (pre-biblical). Some of the origins can be pointed to, and others are a complete mystery. The only synopsis that I could possibly venture is this one: The Bible is a storybook, about how many people from a distant past understood the relationship between God and man, and how they believed that God acts in our lives and how he acted in the past. It is a storybook.

If I had to choose one-way-or-the-other, I would come down firmly on the side of completely disregarding the Bible. But since I have my God-given intellect, and live in a reasonably free country, free of religious coercion like that which can be found today in many Muslim countries throughout the world, and in many Christian countries on the African continent that have been perversely and unduly influenced by fundamentalism, and in many European countries prior to the Protestant reformation, and in many "Catholic nations" still today... Since I am free to use my God-given intellect as I see fit, without fear or coercion, I will occasionally quote from the Bible... when I think it has something valid and important to say. And I will ignore/discard/disregard those portions that don't meet these criteria.

Me too.

VERSE WARS... I love it! For every thrust, a parry. For every Thou Shalt, a Thou Shant This is SO MUCH BETTER than Trivial Pursuit!! !

Isn't turning Witches to Christ on sort of an equal par with Turning a CHRISTIAN into A FROG ??? Both sound like some sort of WITCHCRAFT to me Or am I jest being WICCA'd ???

This gave me one hell of a belly laugh, which did my hay fever no good at all...I nearly choked myself blue. But at least it cleared out my sinuses for a spell! But please...hold up on the zinger lines until the pollen passes???

Uh....actually Fawz, old boy, I think that was my line. see post #137 in which I said: "And the necessary corollary: Free-will could not exist without Evil. That's something to ponder, isn't it? "

And the necessary corollary: Free-will could not exist without Evil. That's something to ponder, isn't it?

FWIW: If you intend to use your ULC ordination to "do active ministry", I would suggest that you "wear a collar" with some regularity. It is a small (and perhaps silly) thing, but most people are affected by such "outward signs" of clerical calling. imho, anyway. Hex of

Dear Goth, to answer your question head-on, your ordination is forever. BTW, NICE CAT!

Well, I'm certainly glad we have cleared that up. For a moment there, I was getting confused!

Thank you for this post, Taukino!

Yes. They originally represented the blood that was shed on the fields of France (and Flanders?) during "the Great War", but have come to symbolize the sacrifices of all fighting men (and women) in all past wars.

. We don't NEED any more witches! Christianity already has way too many of 'em. You would already know that if you spent very much time at coffee hour. Send 'em to the Unitarians! ,,,or maybe you could "just let them be???

This is such a COINCIDENCE... I own TWO MAGAZINES too! ...a June 1964 edition of TIME Magazine, and an April 1957 edition of LOOK. Of course the "LOOK" isn't for serious readers, but hey, it's a magazine!

I'll bet God does too! From The Progressive Christian Alliance: "Genuine faith is not some weapon that shields us from storms of life while pronouncing judgment upon others, but neither is it wholly self-destructive. Rather, it is a weapon that both shields and lacerates the one who wields it, offering comfort to the distressed and distress to the comforted."