SisterSalome

How do your beliefs benefit you and society?

138 posts in this topic

8 hours ago, Dan56 said:
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It almost sounds like the government is your god :).

Your religion exists in your country at the pleasure of the government. Yours is a nation of secular law, not of your immoral God and his satanic laws. 

 

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You really want politicians to decide what's moral?

They already do via laws. Unless you think law is motivated or intended to be immoral.

 

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Asking people to renounce their belief and pledge their allegiance to government sounds somewhat like Nazi Germany. .

How many masters do you follow. What does your pledge say? I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG.

Do you think the U.S. and most other countries to be like Nazi Germany?

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When Christianity started, it was the world that brought death and misery to them.. Christ and his apostles were killed, but it didn't stop the belief.

What's the difference between a moral religion and the 'garbage' religions? I suspect if you threw everyone out who didn't measure up to what you consider moral, you'd be left all alone.. Imo, no one is absolutely moral; "All have sinned, and come short of the glory of God" (Romans 3:23).

 

I am not surprised that you have to ask what's the difference between a moral and immoral religion is as your sense of morality is satanic as you do not see the punishment of the innocent instead of the guilty as immoral.

Regards

DL

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4 hours ago, Gruffydd y Dryw said:

The Druids were referred to as "the most just of men," but somehow I think they would be some of the first ones that Gnostic Bishop would "vote off the island" :)

"The Druids are considered the most just of men, and on this account they are entrusted with the decision, not only of the private disputes, but of the public disputes as well; so that, in former times, they even arbitrated cases of war and made the opponents stop when they were about to line up for battle, and the murder cases, in particular, had been turned over to them for decision." -Strabo (Greek historian, 64 B.C. - 24 A.D.) 

Bendithion (Blessings),

Gruffydd y Dryw /|\

I don't know enough of their moral code to judge but do they, like Christianity, believe it good to punish the innocent instead of the guilty.

 

Do they, like Islam, believe in Honor Killing of women who will not dress as ordered to by men?

 

If the Druids are not that immoral, then I might let them stay.

 

Regards

DL

 

 

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3 hours ago, Gnostic Bishop said:

 you do not see the punishment of the innocent instead of the guilty as immoral

 

Just to clarify, my previous point was simply that the 'innocent' are not protected from suffering or death anymore than the immoral or guilty. No one has a protective bubble over them, disaster, illness, and tragedy hit everyone at random. That's part of life in the flesh.. Punishment comes after judgement, that's when the guilty perish and the innocent (in Christ) ) receive everlasting life. From a biblical prospective, the here & now aren't the big story, our temporary existence in the flesh can be indiscriminately tough, but sometimes even the innocent  have to go through hell to get to heaven.

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In 1492, the Jews of Spain were given a harsh choice.  They could become Christians or they could leave Spain.  So many Jews had sham conversions to Catholicism, that the Church doubted the sincerity of the new converts.  That is how the world came to have, "the Spanish Inquisition."

History repeats.  Banning a religion only gets sham converts.  Nothing good or useful results.  Much that is awful does result.  

We should learn a few lessons from history; instead of repeating the same mistakes.  What possible benefit is to be had, from Muslims going out and getting fake baptisms?  Do we want the government to decide what our religious status is?  Do we want the government to decide what religions or churches are legitimate?  What churches and religions are not legitimate?  That would take us to other disasters.  Here's a hint.  The ULC would be one of the first things thrown into the fire.  Along with the First Amendment.  

:sigh2:     :blink:     :whist:

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19 hours ago, Gnostic Bishop said:

Where does it stop?

That would be up to the courts. Last time it stopped at the lies of I D.

I think Muslim's, because some put Sharia ahead of all other governments, should renounce their immoral Sharia and pledge allegiance to the constitution and U.S. government or yes, get the hell out of the countries.

Where should it stop. At moral religions and not the garbage mainstream religions we have to suffer today.

I would offer choices. Reform to a moral creed and teaching or close shop. Judges and politicians would of course put their thoughts to the process but I would say that none of the fantasy based religions should be tolerated. All they produce is idol worshipers like Christianity and Islam and they bring a lot of death and misery to the world.

 

Regards

DL

 

 

Going with the numbers, the bulk of the "judges and politicians" making these decisions would be Christian.  Many of them Evangelical.  Good by Gnostic Christians.  They only want people with "moral teachings" as they understand them.  Good by Atheists and Agnostics.  Good by Pagans.  We will be told, "this is a Christian country."  Everybody else can get out.

Be careful what you ask for.  It could happen.  Not the way you would like, but it would happen.  If push comes to shove; you will discover that you are not the one deciding what religions are the moral ones.  Quite possibly, nobody would care what you think at all.  You could find yourself on the sh*t list.

:whist:

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5 hours ago, Gnostic Bishop said:

I don't know enough of their moral code to judge but do they, like Christianity, believe it good to punish the innocent instead of the guilty.

 

Do they, like Islam, believe in Honor Killing of women who will not dress as ordered to by men?

 

If the Druids are not that immoral, then I might let them stay.

 

Regards

DL

 

 

 

How very good of you.  Who would be asking your opinion?  Who would stand up for you?

:sigh2:     :whist:

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8 hours ago, Gnostic Bishop said:

You have talked yourself into believing you can be free but in a species like ours, there is no such think.

We can have some freedom from oppression thanks to our political systems but as Socrates put it, you cannot be free. Who would make your shoes.

 

We have liberty thanks to our Western laws. We do not have, and would not allow anyone freedom. We are only free to follow the rules.

 

Jump into your car and try to exercise freedom on our roads and see how quickly your so called freedom lasts.

 

Regards

DL  

 

Liberation comes from within.     :D 

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8 hours ago, Gnostic Bishop said:

Ridding the community of immoral constructs is hardly doing evil.

 

Regards

DL

The people doing the evil, never think that they are doing something evil.     :whist:

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22 hours ago, emalpaiz said:

 

My spiritual life is guided by the following principles: ":Avoid all evil, cultivate the good, purify your mind: this sums up the teachings of the Buddhas"  (The Dhammapada, verse 183).  You should try it sometimes; it is a better path than criticizing evil.

Hermano Luis

  

Yes.  Words of wisdom.     :D 

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On 3/11/2016 at 5:53 PM, Gnostic Bishop said:

Esoteric ecumenists like you should be judging the various belief systems and accepting the good while rejecting and criticizing the evil.

 

For evil to grow, all good people need do is not criticize it.

 

Note above how Dan thinks it ok to punish his child for his evil deeds.

 

If you just ignore such then your morality is as corrupt as his as you are allowing evil thinking to just go unchallenged.

 

You seem to be allowing your soft heart to guide you to immorality.

 

Regards

DL

 

 

 

But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
 
 
:D
 
 
 
Edited by Jonathan H. B. Lobl

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20 hours ago, Dan56 said:

Just to clarify, my previous point was simply that the 'innocent' are not protected from suffering or death anymore than the immoral or guilty. No one has a protective bubble over them, disaster, illness, and tragedy hit everyone at random. That's part of life in the flesh.. Punishment comes after judgement, that's when the guilty perish and the innocent (in Christ) ) receive everlasting life. From a biblical prospective, the here & now aren't the big story, our temporary existence in the flesh can be indiscriminately tough, but sometimes even the innocent  have to go through hell to get to heaven.

The torture of David's baby was not random. It was your God intentionally punishing the innocent instead of the guilty.

The exact immoral policy that your religion and salvation is based on.

Satan could not come up with a more disgusting and immoral policy. You are pushing and applauding Satan's work.

Regards

DL

Edited by Gnostic Bishop

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19 hours ago, Jonathan H. B. Lobl said:

In 1492, the Jews of Spain were given a harsh choice.  They could become Christians or they could leave Spain.  So many Jews had sham conversions to Catholicism, that the Church doubted the sincerity of the new converts.  That is how the world came to have, "the Spanish Inquisition."

History repeats.  Banning a religion only gets sham converts.  Nothing good or useful results.  Much that is awful does result.  

We should learn a few lessons from history; instead of repeating the same mistakes.  What possible benefit is to be had, from Muslims going out and getting fake baptisms?  Do we want the government to decide what our religious status is?  Do we want the government to decide what religions or churches are legitimate?  What churches and religions are not legitimate?  That would take us to other disasters.  Here's a hint.  The ULC would be one of the first things thrown into the fire.  Along with the First Amendment.  

:sigh2:     :blink:     :whist:

All that needs doing is for the government to apply their fraud laws and all the lying priest and imams would either go underground or leave.

You seem to think it is not our duty to each other to protect each other from fraudsters and I do not agree with protecting frauds.

The government already decides what our religious status is in the country. We are in democracies, not Theocracies.

Actually we are all living in oligarchies but few recognize it.

We are living in lies and you seem to think we should just ignore the lying fraudsters.

Regards

DL

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18 hours ago, Jonathan H. B. Lobl said:

 

Going with the numbers, the bulk of the "judges and politicians" making these decisions would be Christian.  Many of them Evangelical.  Good by Gnostic Christians.  They only want people with "moral teachings" as they understand them.  Good by Atheists and Agnostics.  Good by Pagans.  We will be told, "this is a Christian country."  Everybody else can get out.

Be careful what you ask for.  It could happen.  Not the way you would like, but it would happen.  If push comes to shove; you will discover that you are not the one deciding what religions are the moral ones.  Quite possibly, nobody would care what you think at all.  You could find yourself on the sh*t list.

:whist:

All moral judges seek to punish the guilty and not the innocent.

 

Any judge who would side with the Christian view that people should profit by the punishment of the innocent instead of the guilty would soon find himself forced off the bench.

 

Regards

DL

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15 hours ago, Jonathan H. B. Lobl said:

 

But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
 
 
:D
 
 
 

So when you find a rapist doing assaulting wife, run to get your daughter to offer her as his next.

I did not thing your morals that corrupted.

 

Regards

DL

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2 hours ago, Gnostic Bishop said:

All that needs doing is for the government to apply their fraud laws and all the lying priest and imams would either go underground or leave.

You seem to think it is not our duty to each other to protect each other from fraudsters and I do not agree with protecting frauds.

The government already decides what our religious status is in the country. We are in democracies, not Theocracies.

Actually we are all living in oligarchies but few recognize it.

We are living in lies and you seem to think we should just ignore the lying fraudsters.

Regards

DL

 

No.  They don't.  The government has no say in such matters.  None at all.     :blink:

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2 hours ago, Gnostic Bishop said:

1.  All moral judges seek to punish the guilty and not the innocent.

 

2.  Any judge who would side with the Christian view that people should profit by the punishment of the innocent instead of the guilty would soon find himself forced off the bench.

 

Regards

DL

 

1.  The legal system is concerned with law.  Not morality.  Not even your morality.

2.  Seriously?     :lol:     :lol:     :lol:  

 

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2 hours ago, Gnostic Bishop said:

So when you find a rapist doing assaulting wife, run to get your daughter to offer her as his next.

I did not thing your morals that corrupted.

 

Regards

DL

 

Come off it.  I'm the Agnostic.  You're the one who gets his morals from the Gospels.  I quoted from one of your favorite books.  You're issue.  Not mine.  Your book, your morals.  If anybody here lacks morals, it's you.  

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1 hour ago, Jonathan H. B. Lobl said:

 

No.  They don't.  The government has no say in such matters.  None at all.     :blink:

Government determines the law of the land and not religions.

I you were right, the government would not have moved again Branch Dividian or ordered Westboro Baptist away from military funerals.

 

Regards

DL 

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1 hour ago, Jonathan H. B. Lobl said:

 

Come off it.  I'm the Agnostic.  You're the one who gets his morals from the Gospels.  I quoted from one of your favorite books.  You're issue.  Not mine.  Your book, your morals.  If anybody here lacks morals, it's you.  

Not my favorite book and I did not quite that verse, you did.

Strange that you agreed with my morals before and now not.

I like my morals to be challenged, that is why I lay them out for all to see, as that makes them stronger.

Any time I give you something to argue, come ahead. I love to learn.

 

Regards

DL

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On ‎3‎/‎18‎/‎2016 at 8:22 PM, Gnostic Bishop said:

That seem self-centered and avoiding evil means letting it grow.

Your way is certainly not doing unto others.

 

Regards

DL

I think your wrong and I will respect your position,  I do not come to this site to question anyone's believes, I think that I have explained my position sufficiently, not because I am afraid, but because your position is no importance to me.  Thank you!

Hermano Luis

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17 hours ago, Gnostic Bishop said:

The torture of David's baby was not random. It was your God intentionally punishing the innocent instead of the guilty.

The exact immoral policy that your religion and salvation is based on.

Satan could not come up with a more disgusting and immoral policy. You are pushing and applauding Satan's work.

Regards

DL

Torture is your words, its not in the bible.. The baby got sick and died.. And no where does it say God was punishing the baby.

Keep in mind that everybody gets sick and dies, you seem to be preoccupied with the notion that the innocent shouldn't die, but its been going on from the beginning of time. We were all born to die. The good, the bad, and the ugly all face the same fate. Its an indiscriminate part of life that's neither moral or immoral.

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19 hours ago, emalpaiz said:

I think your wrong and I will respect your position,  I do not come to this site to question anyone's believes, I think that I have explained my position sufficiently, not because I am afraid, but because your position is no importance to me.  Thank you!

Hermano Luis

For the evils of religion to grow, read any scripture literally.

 

Any and all harmless beliefs are allowed by Gnostic Christians. We know that any myth can be internalized for good results and as esoteric ecumenists, we enjoy knowledge of all the myths that man has created about Gods.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02ciandvg&feature=BFa&list=PLCBF574D

 

When there is a victim is when that view changes. Then you see why Christianity annihilated Gnostic Christianity. We do not let the evils of forced literalism go unopposed. To a tyrant like Constantine, we were poison. One of his first commands to his new Church was to kill off the free thinkers and of course, his new tool, his Church, did as bid. It was quite a ride for free thought for the next 1,000 years.

 

How can a Gnostic Christian, --- and any other free thinking moral person, --- not judge other's morals when seeing someone hurt other because of the same Church's teachings today?

 

 Can you ignore such things if you have decent morals? Impossible. Especially with Islam pulling the same murderous, freedom stifling ****.

 

We must discriminate and judge constantly. Every law is a compulsion on all of us to judge.

 

It is my view that all right wing literalists and fundamentals hurt all of us who are moral religionists, --- as well as those who do not believe. Literalists hurt their parent religions --- and everyone else, be he a believer or not. Literalists and the right wing of religions make us all into laughing stocks. Their God of talking animals, genocidal floods and retribution has got to go. So must beliefs in fantasy, miracles and magic. These are all evil.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2zhlDbMfDg

 

They also do much harm to their own fellow adherents.

 

 African witches and Jesus

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pr6gvtYrga8

 

 Jesus Camp 1of 3

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LACyLTsH4ac

 

Death to Gays.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyuKLyGUHNE

 

 For evil to grow my friend, all good people need do is nothing. Fight literalism when you can. It is your duty to our fellow man.

 ----------

 

I find it strange that if you lived where those children are being tormented and killed for being witches or if your community was trying to implement a kill the gays policy, that you would avoid those evil topics and just continue to seek your own nirvana.

 

 Regards

 DL

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6 hours ago, Dan56 said:

Torture is your words, its not in the bible.. The baby got sick and died.. And no where does it say God was punishing the baby.

Keep in mind that everybody gets sick and dies, you seem to be preoccupied with the notion that the innocent shouldn't die, but its been going on from the beginning of time. We were all born to die. The good, the bad, and the ugly all face the same fate. Its an indiscriminate part of life that's neither moral or immoral.

Seems that you do not mind distorting the truth to maintain your view that God did not act in an immoral way.

 

"no where does it say God was punishing the baby"

 

http://biblehub.com/2_samuel/12-15.htm

After Nathan had gone home, the LORD struck the child that Uriah's wife had borne to David, and he became ill.

 

To strike a baby with illness that will kill it after 6 days of imposed torture by God, is to punish it quite severely. 

 

If I did not think you honest, I might thing you were trying to deceive us.

 

Regards

DL

 

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22 hours ago, Gnostic Bishop said:

Government determines the law of the land and not religions.

I you were right, the government would not have moved again Branch Dividian or ordered Westboro Baptist away from military funerals.

 

Regards

DL 

First sentence, correct.

Second sentence, incorrect. The government moved against the Waco Branch Davidians, (I emphasized "Waco", as there were other Branch Davidians at other locations not associated with them), for reasons of: possible illegal arms possession, child endangerment claims, and underage marriage claims (with which rape could also be claimed due to age of consent).

Westboro Baptist was ordered away due to trespass laws and common decency to families of the deceased.

Neither case was due to religion, but rather to legal justification due to law of the land. Religion is only a common element that you and others align them with to interpret any anti-government sentiment.

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33 minutes ago, Key said:

First sentence, correct.

Second sentence, incorrect. The government moved against the Waco Branch Davidians, (I emphasized "Waco", as there were other Branch Davidians at other locations not associated with them), for reasons of: possible illegal arms possession, child endangerment claims, and underage marriage claims (with which rape could also be claimed due to age of consent).

Westboro Baptist was ordered away due to trespass laws and common decency to families of the deceased.

Neither case was due to religion, but rather to legal justification due to law of the land. Religion is only a common element that you and others align them with to interpret any anti-government sentiment.

I note and see and that you are aware of the moral reasons that government moved against the Branch Dividians.

My main point.

The Westboro picketing ban had nothing to do with trespassing as they were on public lands. From what I can see, it was all common decency that prompted the restrictions. 

 

Common decency to the gullible is also why I would ban Christianity and Islam as all that both are good for is creating homophobes and misogynous people. They do appease the hiving instincts of the insecure but that is not worth the harm they do.

 

Regards

DL

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