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Posts posted by Verisoph

  1. 1. Why are we actually here and what is it exactly apart from the biochemical and other components that we are?

    Why does there have to be a why? I don't except that there's anything to us apart from the biochemical.

    2. What is the point and purpose of existence? --this is for all believers, and non believers inclusive?

    Why must there be a point and purpose?

    3. If we presume --as some, that there is no afterlife, then why are we (most) clinging to life? If we go with that theory is it not easier and better to end it sooner or later?

    This question strikes me as ridiculous. This is the only life that I know I have - of course I'm going to cling to it - when it's over, then that's IT! If I believed that my life was going to go on forever, then I wouldn'i mind ending it in the least.

    4. Why have children--simply to perpetuate the cycle of suffering??--if we presume that is no God, no spirituality, no faith as Hyper surmises--which maybe correct, non of us can prove the `pro or contra` for it is simply personal experience of experiencing the divine.

    I don't have any children. I never desired any. I can't speak for anyone else. But, I will say that life is much, much more than a cycle of suffering.

    I don't understand the rest of your question.

    5. Why are we killing each other, the planet and all of creation deliberately?

    I have not killed anyone, I'm not killing the planet, and I'm unsure that the word 'creation' fits.

  2. ~ Hi Veri! :wub::D

    Hello Qryos. There's not enough Dancing Muses around, that's for sure.

    Well, if everyone wants to get technical, plants couldn't see any animal, human or other as pacifist...

    C'mon folks, a pacifist is simply someone that seeks a non-violent solution to a problem before just yellin' "Cowabunga! Nuke 'em!"

    A peaceful protest like a sit-in instead of a riot.

    A candle-lit vigil rather than a shouting match.

    Pacifism doesn't necessarily mean cowardice or running away, it means striving to find a peaceful resolution to a difficulty, one not involving violence.

    Well said.

  3. Verisoph, long time no speak....

    Indeed. I hope all is well with you.

    So, "you kill all kinds of things!!!" As you stated?? How is that pacifism? Sounds like rationalisation to me......

    I kill bugs mostly. Jains are the only people I know of who try not to kill anything. If you're redefining pacifism to mean someone who won't kill anything, then by your definition, I am not a pacifist. But, this is not the definition that most people use. I suspect you know this.

    Regarding your view of evolution.... the creatures you mention that will not kill to further their life are fictional.

    Nonsense! Sparrows kill all sorts fo creatures, but they do not kill other sparrows, Bees will try to kill creatures that threaten their hive, even commiting suicide in the process. But, they do not kill other bees of their type. This is how most creatures behave. Have you ever heard of a cat bringing a dead cat home to it's owner.

    Life is different than books!

    Often, yes, What has that got to do with anything?

  4. Being something that doesn't GET killed is what survives the best.

    Not necessarily true. Imagine a creature that can kill 90% of what comes along, but only one in a thousand will find enough food to surive a single day. Compare that to a creature that wins half of the fights it gets in, yet has plenty of food.

    Besides, the sentence you quoted was not meant to be taken by itself. It was part of a bigger thought,

  5. Meaning, in terms of my above and all posts, to be found in nature. I am not aware of any species that will refuse the act of violence over survival of one’s self or their offspring.

    Now, you may cite some obscure spider or the radical human progressive that has lost his/her survival instincts, to which I would concede that there may be that odd and naturally evolving dysfunction. But there is sufficient data and knowledge to support that within the animal kingdom the notion of pacifism is a contrived pipe dream, and certainly a dead-end on any evolutionary chart.

    I do believe you're missing something. I kill all kinds of things, but I do not kill other people. I'm a pacifist, Most animals are the same, they'll kill different species, but not their own kind. Using this logic, it is pacifism that is natural. Of course I don't see what natural has to do with it.

    Further, if you're going to bring evolution into the picture, you're wrong. A creature that will not kill any other creature is exactly what evolution has created ... through survival. Being something that doesn't kill is what survives best.

  6. What is rarer a Verisoph siting or a Blue Moon?

    Great to see you again.

    Fawzo, I'm honored.

    welcome back soph.

    Thank you, Mark

    So you both agree that some animals kill for reasons other than hunger. Sure, it also happens as a result of protection, defense, and even randomness. Animals are animals. But I don't think that is the point. The point is, is it natural to be a pacifist? And of course the natural answer is no.

    Could you please define 'natural'.

  7. Well, we can blame God for creating the evil things which we choose to do, but do you think that song & dance will fly with God come judgment day? :) Everything God created was good, God didn't create evil, but he will destroy it.

    By golly, that'll teach everyone who doesn't believe what you believe.

  8. Hello Pollux, welcome to the forum :)

    Please help me to calm my mind...

    True peace of mind comes from within, not from without. I can't make your mind calm, but if you'll allow yourself to relax, you can. Just as I can't calm your mind, in most situations, no one else can disrupt your tranquility unless you allow it. It's all up to you, my friend.

  9. Can atheists be spiritual? Of course they can. It's really a pretty silly question. Anyone who doesn't believe in any gods is an atheist - that's the only qualification. So, unless spiritual is being defined, at least in part, as someone who believes in one or more gods, then an atheist could fit the definition. People can believe in all kinds of stuff and still be atheists, they just have to lack a belief in gods.

    I understand that atheists are often treated badly by some people who seem to think they have no right to exist (IMO), but not by all theists.

    It's true. I lost a job once because it was discovered that I didn't believe in God. I don't think the management at that business thought that I had no right to exist, but they certainly thought that I had no right to work there.

    Just to give you an idea about how much atheists are disliked in the US, here are the results of a question asked in a 2007 Gallup poll (look at the very bottom):


    Here's the source of the info: - poll 26611

  10. I really don't know why I am posting this or what I hope to accomplish. I guess that I feel that some of the most intelligent, thoughtful and caring people I know are on here and maybe someone will have an answer or maybe just some insight.

    I am so frustrated and angry with my life right now that I don't know what to do. Everyday I wonder why I go on. Everyday is worse than yesterday. Everyday I think, "why keep struggling when you know it's just going to be worse tomorrow?".

    People say, "They come up with new techniques and medicines everyday. Don't lose hope."

    Too late, I ran out of hope a long time ago and now I feel like I just keep going because I don't know what else to do. I talk myself out of suicide everyday. Why?

    Why? I'd say it's because you haven't yet lost ALL hope. Sure, tomorrow will be worse than today. Next month might be worse than last month. But who knows, by next year you might be in perfect shape, and you just might remain that way for longer than you've ever dreamt possible.

    Not only are medical scientists making truly amazing discoveries, but the progress of biotechnology is advancing at an ever increasing rate. We may well be living on the verge of a time when human lives will span hundreds of years. Personally, what keeps me going is curiosity - I want to see just how far it all might go. If it's a pipe dream, then so be it, I'll die when the time comes and it will all be over for me. Or, I could end it all now, in which case it will all be over just the same, only I'll never know what might have been.

  11. Oy vey! Jesus, Mithras and now Newton as if I don't have enough presents I already have to buy. I'm sticking to Happy Holidays and the irate Christians can go pray to their Lord and ask for tolerance and goodwill towards their fellow man.

    I don't have time to figure out whether the person I'm speaking with is Jewish, Muslim, Atheist, Apathetic , Pagan or Christian or even human half the time.

    Wishing them a Happy Newtonmass is going to be just as unsettling to them as wishing them Happy Holidays methinks. I do think however we should start leaving Santa an apple and some fig newtons. I heard his cholesterol and triglyceride numbers were up there.

    How dare you even consider wishing anyone a Happy Newtonmass?

    It's Merry Newtonmass! :angry:

  12. I tried searching to see if that was an actual holiday but all that kept coming up was Newton Massachusettes.

    I've recently learned that there are Christians who hate Christmas in part because there are non-Christians around who say "Merry Christmas." I've been aware for a few years that there are Christians around who get angry when people say "Happy Holidays." I confess, I'm guilty of both of these.

    I really don't want to offend folks, or cause them to hate particular days, but I like the holiday and I don't want to give up on it just because there are some Christians who, in my opinion, are overly concerned about me and what I do and say. So, until I find something better, I'll be celebrating Newtonmass on December 25th.

    Merry Newtonmass from

    Merry Newtonmass from

    Origin of Newton-Day or Newton-Mass from

    AtheistNexus says this about it:

    I came up with lists of scientists, artists, writers, engineers, philosophers and so on, and as far as I can see the least contentious and most likely to be agreed upon list would be that of scientists - the big four being Galileo, Newton, Darwin and Einstein. As it happens, Newton's birthday is December the 25th!

    ...I wondered if there was anyone better than Newton to select for this day? I was looking for people who had made a positive contribution to society and avoided those who have caused suffering, violence, disruption and worse. Jesus, if he existed and is actually as portrayed in conventional christian views, most certainly fails in this regard, since he surely would have known all the suffering, persecution, violence and death that was to come that would have been carried out in his name.

    Compare that to Newton with his Optics, Laws of Motion and Gravitational Attraction, and the Calculus, all one way or another incredibly significant ideas and tools that have shaped and contributed to our world today and no-one has died in his name either. So there really is no contest. If today needs to be a day to remember anyone at all, it should be Isaac Newton.”

    I don't know about all that, but I figure that if Jesus really did exist, the chance that he was actually born on Saturnalia (December 25th) is 1 in 365.25 - not such great odds. We know that Isaac Newton was born on December 25th.

    In this holiday do folks sit under decorated Apple Trees and eat fig newtons?

    :lol: If they'd like. There are no rigid rules in place, but it's mostly have fun, eat a lot, exchange gifts, you know the kind of stuff that Pagans were doing on December 25th for centuries before Christians started copying them.


  13. Is there anything extra or anything special I would need to do when marrying them?

    You'll need to perform the ceremony in a way that she'll understand. Perhaps something like this: G'day chick, do you take this bloke to be your husband?

    Hey, just kidding.


  14. Christmas used to be my favorite holiday. It was always the most magical time of year as a child - happy decorations, family fun, and of course presents from Santa. I waited for it all year and it seemed like it would never arrive. Now that I am older and jaded, Christmas just doesn't hold the same appeal. I have talked with many people about my problems with the current American traditions. Here are some of my primary problems:

    1) It is a religious holiday, yet it is popularly accepted by most people, barring their faith in another religion; even then many folks still participate in gift-giving or other events. It doesn't matter if you don't pray, or go to church, or even believe in God or Jesus, many people still give presents and say "Merry Christmas." Why?

    That's why you don't like Christmas anymore? Maybe you're just too worried about what other people do. Or, maybe not - that's something only you can decide.

    4) In America, it seems that the main figure associated with Christmas is not Christ, but Santa Claus. You can Google "Christmas" and see for yourself - after the Wikipedia page about Christmas, the second link is Santa Claus and Christmas at the North Pole. The first sponsored link is Track Santa 'til Christmas, followed by GE - Santa's New Sleigh. Only near the bottom of the first page is there a link to anything religious, a Catholic encyclopedia entry about Christmas. Why has the focus shifted from Jesus Christ to Santa Claus?

    These are some of the issues I have with Christmas. I try to enjoy this time of year, but it's difficult when every ad on TV is telling me which phone to give for Christmas, which stores to shop at, and nobody seems to care that celebrating the positive message of Christ has fallen by the wayside. At this point I just dread Christmas and want it to be over.

    Um, not meaning to be rude or anything, but I feel I should point out that you said that as a child Christmas seemed magical to you because of happy decorations, family fun, and of course presents from Santa.

    There's no mention of the positive message of Christ there.