Ex Nihilo

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  1. Among the major differences with traditional Christianity, members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, as the Mormon Church is officially called, do not believe in the concept of the unified Trinity; the Book of Mormon is considered sacred text, alongside the Bible and two other texts; and Mormons believe that God has a physical body and that human beings can eventually become like God.

    http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/subjects/m/mormons_church_of_jesus_christ_of_latterday_saints/index.html?offset=0&s=newest

    In Mormonism: The trinity is three separate Gods: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. "That these three are separate individuals, physically distinct from each other, is demonstrated by the accepted records of divine dealings with man," (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 35).

    Richard D Land the president of the Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission of the Southern Baptist Convention, who calls Mormonism a fourth Abrahamic religion, along with Judaism, Christianity and Islam. Being set apart from Christianity.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/13/opinion/im-a-mormon-not-a-christian.html?ref=mormonschurchofjesuschristoflatterdaysaints

    hi sarkany, in your quote it did not say they believe in three gods, they believe in three physically seperate persons, which sounds very much like just what the trinity is: one god in three persons (natures) coeternal and consubstantial. The trinity concept necessitates physical distinctness because the father is pure spirit, Jesus is both divine ans human, ie, corporeal, and the holy spirit is that part of god which proceeds from the father and the son to permeate, vivify, and sanctify all creation. They have always been and always will be sepetate yet united in one godhead. To deny this is to embrace unitarianism which is the very thing the athanasian creed seeks to anathematize.

    As for the SBC preacher, is be careful listening to him, I know what SBCs think of catholics...they might be biased.

  2. Jesus is part of the trinity, and therefore belief in him as not only messiah and savior, but also second person of the godhead is necessary for salvific Christian faith but it is not sufficient. There must also be belief in god the father and god the holy spirit, according to most Christians. People who believe in Jesus but not the One who sent him or the one who came after could hardly be called a christiam, at least in the traditional sense

  3. I find this interesting--who said objectivism is dead :derisive: it is alive and well it seems.

    Back in 2005, an up-and-coming lawmaker named Paul Ryan credited the polemical novelist and libertarian Ayn Rand as a central inspiration for his entry into public life. Ryan toiled in those days in relative obscurity, a well-respected but low-profile member of the House of Representatives.

    By the spring of 2012, the boyish congressman had become a Republican star, widely named as a possible vice presidential pick. He also had become considerably less comfortable being linked to the controversial Rand, an atheist with a tartly Darwinian world view.

    As Ryan and the Republicans look to define the new vice presidential choice’s brand, part of the commentary will be about just how Randian (read: unsympathetic to the weak) the candidate really is.

    Ayn Rand wrote the bestselling “Atlas Shrugged.” She also encouraged the world’s “makers” to pursue “rational self interest” as “the highest moral purpose of [one's] life,” while giving little care to the nefarious “takers.”

    Journalists who have recently written about Ryan suggested that his infatuation with the Russian émigré author, who died in 1982 at age 77, has hardly waned. The favorite son of Wisconsin has recently been insisting that his embrace of Rand amounted to a youthful infatuation. In an April interview with the National Review, Ryan said that the reports linking him to Rand were essentially “an urban legend.”

    “I reject her philosophy,” Ryan told Robert Costa of the National Review. “It’s an atheist philosophy. It reduces human interactions down to mere contracts and it is antithetical to my worldview.” He added that he had merely “enjoyed a couple of her novels,” which also included another bestseller, “The Fountainhead.”

    But Ryan made no bones about his philosophical influences just a few years ago. He told the Weekly Standard in 2003 that he gave his staffers copies of “Atlas Shrugged” as Christmas presents. Speaking to a group of Rand acolytes in 2005, Ryan said, “The reason I got involved in public service, by and large, if I had to credit one thinker, one person, it would be Ayn Rand. And the fight we are in here, make no mistake about it, is a fight of individualism versus collectivism.”

    Even three years ago, Tim Mak of Politico noted, Ryan channeled Rand. “What’s unique about what’s happening today in government, in the world, in America, is that it’s as if we’re living in an Ayn Rand novel right now,” Ryan said. “I think Ayn Rand did the best job of anybody to build a moral case of capitalism, and that morality of capitalism is under assault.”

    http://www.latimes.c...0,1175099.story

    blessings and peace,

    S

    I know people are trying to pawn this guy off as a Randian because he'll sometimes pull out a quote and used to toy with the philosophy back in college, but one quick look show him to be nothing more than a big government conservative in libertarian clothing. He's a younger, slightly more eloquent George W. Bush.

  4. Cults are centered around the personalities and persons of cult-leaders, Mormonism honors Joseph Smith as a prophet but does not worship him as god incarnate. The sect did not die out with the death of Smith, it has continued to grow and evolve. I have a number of friends who are Mormon. They pray in Christ's name, read the bible along with their book of Mormon, and exhibit far more of the Christ-likeness than most other Christians I know.

    I am not a Mormon, but I don't see how the changes they've made to their theology is any more unique and marginal than Pentecostals evangelicals, Protestants, Anglicans, Catholics, orthodox, baptists, or Quakers...Each sect has its own distinctive doctrines and views on the godhead (some would call these heresies but I think that's above my pay grade). That doesn't make them cults in anything other than the academic sense. According to the Athanasian creed, what makes a christian a christian is his adherence to the Trinitarian faith. Mormons believe the trinity, thus they are Christians. They may very well be wrong, but God said to be faithful not infallible.

  5. This past weekend, I came across a leather-bound edition of The Prophesies of Nostradamus for $0.50 (Score!!) at the local thrift shop. I've enjoyed reading the couplets. His final one reads:

    "Long awaited, he will never come in Europe

    He will appear in Asia

    One issued from the Great Hermes

    He will be over all the kings of the East."

    Is this the coming Christ? Antichrist? Anyone care to interpret?? Does anyone find his predictions to be prophetic?

    As a kid, I watched the Orson Wells documentary about Nostradamus. It showed the third antichrist coming from the middle east. It showed him sending missiles to NYC and one missed its target(...maybe it could have been ariplanes used as missiles...hmmm). This was to initiate a third world war. It scared the bejeezus out of me because they said the war would start in 1996, the year I graduated from highschool. I just knew I was doomed for the draft.

  6. While I don't know what will happen definitively, if anything, on December 21, 2012, I believe that the world is lurching toward some great sea change. I feel it in my bones, as do most people I speak to. As a planet, I think we are coming to the realization that the road we've been travelling is leading to a spiritual and evolutionary cul-de-sac. I think some day, sooner rather than later, big BIG changes will be on the horizon. What they will be and how they will affect us, I don't know. But one thing is for sure, we won't (can't) continue to live as we have been. It may be an end, it may also be a new beginning...For my part I hope we are standing on threshold of a new age...the messianic age...the age of aquarius...something like that.

  7. I believe the Mormonism is a sect within Christianity. They believe in the trinity. They use the bible and biblical doctrines. True, their perspective and theology has been heavily colored by Joseph Smith and subsequent prophets. They are a very unique form of Christianity but Christian nonetheless.

  8. Hi all, I'd like to tell a story about a difficult day in my life and how god brought me through it. Seven years ago today, an aunt whom I loved dearly passed away after a long and terrible bout with cancer. for weeks prior to that day she'd been so weak she was unconscious almost all the time and could no longer speak. And that morning, the morning of august 9 2005, I woke up with the overwhelming feeling that she would be leaving us. I was so worried for her, I worried that she was in pain, whether she needed to tell us something but couldn't, but mostly I worried that she was afraid of what was coming. She was so strong in her faith but I couldn't help thinking that the battle she'd been through over the last year may have caused her to falter. By the time I got to work I was almost sick. I went in to my desk and there was a copy of a Methodist devotional, called the upperroom, sitting there. This was odd because no one I worked with was Methodist. At some point in the day, I picked it up and turned it to that day's article. It just so happpened to be about people nearing death from terminal disease. It was written by a woman who was in the last stages of cancer (a note at the bottom of the page said she had passed prior to the devotional's publishing). I have found a link to it here:

    http://devotional.upperroom.org/devotionals/2005-08-09

    What she had to say blew me away. It was like god was using this article to tell me what aunt Linda could not. I could almost hear her voice in the words as I read it. It gave such peace. I realized that no matter how dark the valley, god would bring us to final victory. a couple weeks after her death, I was faced with the very real possibility of losing my newborn daughter, this message came back to me and gave me strength to have hope no matter the outcome. Every year, I reread this article and reflect on how aunt Linda blessed me and give thanks for the life we got to share here on earth and the eternal life we'll share in heaven. --God bless

  9. Pacifism is not against self protection or self preservation. Ofcourse I would march into battle to fight to protect my family, my country if all options were exhausted. Your examples are self preservation, self protection--the term pacifism refers to war in my opinion.

    Your temple example of Jesus was simply act of anger not an act of war--nobody was killed. Jesus absolutely was the personification of a pacifist in all his actions and words. I doubt very much he would support war.Even David got scolded by God for being war like:

    But this word of the Lord came to me: 'You have shed much blood and have fought many wars. You are not to build a house for my Name, because you have shed much blood on the earth in my sight. (1 Chronicles 22:8)

    Jesus appeared to teach pacifism during his ministry when he told his disciples:

    You have heard that it was said, 'An
    , and a tooth for a tooth.' But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek,
    . (Matt. 5:38-39)

    , do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. (Matt. 5:43-48, Luke 6:27-28)

    Put your sword back in its place...for all who
    . (Matt. 26:52)

    , for they shall be called sons of God. (Matt. 5:9)

    http://en.wikipedia....istian_pacifism

    peace,

    S

    I highly dig this!
  10. Not at all... Jesus didn't resist his crucifixion because he was fighting a spiritual war, so he willingly and bravely died for a purpose, it was the reason he came into the world. Jesus suffered and died for the sins of the world so others might live. No coward would die for someone else, a coward would have wimped-out and ran for his life when the Sanhedrin came to arrest him in Gethsemane. Sacrificing or endangering your life for the sake of others requires an unselfish act, and that is something a pacifist would never do. Remember when the crowd was about to stone the adulteress to death? Jesus stepped in and stopped it from happening, a coward wouldn't have cared or interfered, but would have been content to sit by and watched the show. Also consider that Christ drove the money changers out of the temple area with a whip, no pacifist would have done such a thing.

    “There is a time for everything and a season for every activity under the heaven…a time to kill and a time to heal, a time to tear down and a time to build…a time to love and a time to hate, a time for war and a time for peace” (Ecclesiastes 3).

    pacifist all fight spiritual wars, just not physical ones. Sp
  11. Rereading Lord of the Rings series. Also been reading a number of William Walker Atkinson titles free on kindle. Also, just started Disobedience and Democracy by Howard Sunny. I'm such a fan of A people's history that i wanted to see what else he'd written. Highly recommend all of the above.

    Bro k, you've got great taste!

  12. The bible says vengeance is the Lord's, he will repay. I just want to get out of his way. Jesus taught to not resist evil and to repay evil with good. When an apostle tried to defend jesus in the garden on the night of his betrayal by drawing a sword and chopping off the ear of a temple guard, he told him to put it away. In Isaiah, one of the most beautiful prophesies he gives is the vision of future generations beating swords into plowshares where no one will learn war anymore. Jesus in called the prince of peace, I don't think its just a pretty name. My point is that while god may not be a pacifist, he wants those called in his name to be nonviolent. "If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live at peace with all men." Like Rev. Rainbow, I, for my part want to be a peacemaker.

  13. I believe in nonagression, but I do not go so far as to say self defense and defense of others when life or liberty is at stake is wrong, even if violence is used. I once thought about joining the libertarian party but they make you affirm an oath that you would nor support violence in order to achieve any political end. I thought about that and realized that it would negate the American revolution and the declaration of independence. If that policy were followed, wed still be subjects of the crown. Defensive violence,when measured and for good cause, is ok imho.

  14. Yep Bro, I live about 8 minutes from the park. My kids go hiking there all the time. But this is my first concert there. It's truly one of God's little jewels. Next month they'll be hosting Mumford & Sons, Dawes, and Slow Club. I don't what divinely inspired planets aligned that my three favorite bands would all join together and perform but I am oh so so grateful.

    If your a fan, Crosby Stills & Nash will be there on August 21. Definitely worth a road trip. What an experience it would be.

  15. At the end all of em got up and sang and played together. One of the great moments in my life. As I watched them from my place snuggled in the great outcrops of rocks that carve out the amphitheater, I stared out at the plain beyond, the distant twinkle of Denver's lights, and the huge night sky above. I remembered why I had to move away from my home in GA. I thought of all the folks who told me what a terrible idea it was and how there's nothing out west that wasn't right there. I thought how they'll never get to see what I've been blessed to see or walk where I've walked. I felt incredibly sorry I couldn't show them that there are special places in this world. There are things, sacred and strange and wonderful, that are worth the journey. As I listened the the chorus of Deportees, I looked up and I saw 3 shooting stars and I thought yep, God's a fan. It changed me Grateful. (but it could have all just been a contact high, the air was unexpectedly herbal for a an audience so...ahem...otherwise mature and upstanding. But then I remembered this is Colorado and it is arlo guthrie)